Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+ on sale
now at
14th Mar 2018
Eben Upton
479 comments
Here’s a long post. We think you’ll find it interesting. If you don’t have
time to read it all, we recommend you watch this video, which will fill you
in with everything you need, and then head straight to the product
page to fill yer boots. (We recommend the video anyway, even if you do
have time for a long read. ‘Cos it’s fab.)
A BRAND-NEW PI FOR π DAY
Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+ is now on sale now for .
If you’ve been a Raspberry Pi watcher for a while now, you’ll have a bit
of a feel for how we update our products. Just over two years ago, we
released Raspberry Pi 3 Model B. This was our first 64-bit product, and
our first product to feature integrated wireless connectivity. Since then,
we’ve sold over nine million Raspberry Pi 3 units (we’ve sold 19 million
Raspberry Pis in total), which have been put to work in schools, homes,
offices and factories all over the globe.
Those Raspberry Pi watchers will know that we have a history of
releasing improved versions of our products a couple of years into their
lives. The first example was Raspberry Pi 1 Model B+, which added two
additional USB ports, introduced our current form factor, and rolled up a
variety of other feedback from the community. Raspberry Pi 2 didn’t get
this treatment, of course, as it was superseded after only one year; but it
feels like it’s high time that Raspberry Pi 3 received the “plus” treatment.
So, without further ado, Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+ is now on sale for (the
same price as the existing Raspberry Pi 3 Model B), featuring:
Hardware
Software
Books & magazines
Learn
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About us
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help
A 1.4GHz 64-bit quad-core ARM Cortex-A53 CPU
Dual-band 802.11ac wireless LAN and Bluetooth 4.2
Faster Ethernet (Gigabit Ethernet over USB 2.0)
Power-over-Ethernet support (with separate PoE HAT)
Improved PXE network and USB mass-storage booting
Improved thermal management
Alongside a 200MHz increase in peak CPU clock frequency, we have
roughly three times the wired and wireless network throughput,
and the ability to sustain high performance for much longer periods.
Behold the shiny
Raspberry Pi 3B+ is available to buy today from our network of
Approved Resellers.
New features, new chips
Roger Thornton did the design work on this revision of the Raspberry
Pi. Here, he and I have a chat about what’s new.
Introducing the Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+
Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+ is now on sale now for .
The new product is built around BCM2837B0, an updated version of the
64-bit Broadcom application processor used in Raspberry Pi 3B, which
incorporates power integrity optimisations, and a heat spreader (that’s
the shiny metal bit you can see in the photos). Together these allow us
to reach higher clock frequencies (or to run at lower voltages to reduce
power consumption), and to more accurately monitor and control the
temperature of the chip.
Dual-band wireless LAN and Bluetooth are provided by the Cypress
CYW43455 “combo” chip, connected to a Proant PCB antenna similar
to the one used on Raspberry Pi Zero W. Compared to its predecessor,
Raspberry Pi 3B+ delivers somewhat better performance in the 2.4GHz
band, and far better performance in the 5GHz band, as demonstrated by
these iperf results from LibreELEC developer Milhouse.
Tx bandwidth
(Mb/s)
Rx bandwidth
(Mb/s)
Raspberry Pi 3B 35.7 35.6
Raspberry Pi 3B+
(2.4GHz) 46.7 46.3
Raspberry Pi 3B+ (5GHz) 102 102
The wireless circuitry is encapsulated under a metal shield, rather
fetchingly embossed with our logo. This has allowed us to certify the
entire board as a radio module under FCC rules, which in turn will
significantly reduce the cost of conformance testing Raspberry Pi-based
products.
We’ll be teaching metalwork next.
Previous Raspberry Pi devices have used the LAN951x family of chips,
which combine a USB hub and 10/100 Ethernet controller. For
Raspberry Pi 3B+, Microchip have supported us with an upgraded
version, LAN7515, which supports Gigabit Ethernet. While the USB 2.0
connection to the application processor limits the available bandwidth,
we still see roughly a threefold increase in throughput compared to
Raspberry Pi 3B. Again, here are some typical iperf results.
Tx bandwidth (Mb/s) Rx bandwidth (Mb/s)
Raspberry Pi 3B 94.1 95.5
Raspberry Pi 3B+ 315 315
We use a magjack that supports Power over Ethernet (PoE), and bring
the relevant signals to a new 4-pin header. We will shortly launch a PoE
HAT which can generate the 5V necessary to power the Raspberry Pi
from the 48V PoE supply.
There… are… four… pins!
Coming soon to a Raspberry Pi 3B+ near you
Raspberry Pi 3B was our first product to support PXE Ethernet boot.
Testing it in the wild shook out a number of compatibility issues with
particular switches and traffic environments. Gordon has rolled up fixes
for all known issues into the BCM2837B0 boot ROM, and PXE boot is
now enabled by default.
Clocking, voltages and thermals
The improved power integrity of the BCM2837B0 package, and the
improved regulation accuracy of our new MaxLinear MxL7704 power
management IC, have allowed us to tune our clocking and voltage rules
for both better peak performance and longer-duration sustained
performance.
Below 70°C, we use the improvements to increase the core frequency
to 1.4GHz. Above 70°C, we drop to 1.2GHz, and use the improvements
to decrease the core voltage, increasing the period of time before we
reach our 80°C thermal throttle; the reduction in power consumption is
such that many use cases will never reach the throttle. Like a modern
smartphone, we treat the thermal mass of the device as a resource, to
be spent carefully with the goal of optimising user experience.
This graph, courtesy of Gareth Halfacree, demonstrates that Raspberry
Pi 3B+ runs faster and at a lower temperature for the duration of an
eight‑minute quad‑core Sysbench CPU test.
Note that Raspberry Pi 3B+ does consume substantially more power
than its predecessor. We strongly encourage you to use a high-
quality 2.5A power supply, such as the official Raspberry Pi Universal
Power Supply.
FAQs
We’ll keep updating this list over the next couple of days, but here are a
few to get you started.
Are you discontinuing earlier Raspberry Pi models?
No. We have a lot of industrial customers who will want to stick with the
existing products for the time being. We’ll keep building these models for
as long as there’s demand. Raspberry Pi 1B+, Raspberry Pi 2B, and
Raspberry Pi 3B will continue to sell for , , and respectively.
What about Model A+?
Raspberry Pi 1A+ continues to be the entry-level “big” Raspberry Pi for
the time being. We are considering the possibility of producing a
Raspberry Pi 3A+ in due course.
What about the Compute Module?
CM1, CM3 and CM3L will continue to be available. We may offer
versions of CM3 and CM3L with BCM2837B0 in due course, depending
on customer demand.
Are you still using VideoCore?
Yes. VideoCore IV 3D is the only publicly-documented 3D graphics core
for ARM‑based SoCs, and we want to make Raspberry Pi more open
over time, not less.
Credits
A project like this requires a vast amount of focused work from a large
team over an extended period. Particular credit is due to Roger
Thornton, who designed the board and ran the exhaustive (and
exhausting) RF compliance campaign, and to the team at the Sony UK
Technology Centre in Pencoed, South Wales. A partial list of others who
made major direct contributions to the BCM2837B0 chip program,
CYW43455 integration, LAN7515 and MxL7704 developments, and
Raspberry Pi 3B+ itself follows:
James Adams, David Armour, Jonathan Bell, Maria Blazquez, Jamie
Brogan-Shaw, Mike Buffham, Rob Campling, Cindy Cao, Victor Carmon,
KK Chan, Nick Chase, Nigel Cheetham, Scott Clark, Nigel Clift, Dominic
Cobley, Peter Coyle, Jon Cronk, Di Dai, Kurt Dennis, David Doyle,
Andrew Edwards, Phil Elwell, John Ferdinand, Doug Freegard, Ian
Furlong, Shawn Guo, Philip Harrison, Jason Hicks, Stefan Ho, Andrew
Hoare, Gordon Hollingworth, Tuomas Hollman, EikPei Hu, James
Hughes, Andy Hulbert, Anand Jain, David John, Prasanna Kerekoppa,
Shaik Labeeb, Trevor Latham, Steve Le, David Lee, David Lewsey,
Sherman Li, Xizhe Li, Simon Long, Fu Luo Larson, Juan Martinez,
Sandhya Menon, Ben Mercer, James Mills, Max Passell, Mark Perry,
Eric Phiri, Ashwin Rao, Justin Rees, James Reilly, Matt Rowley, Akshaye
Sama, Ian Saturley, Serge Schneider, Manuel Sedlmair, Shawn
Shadburn, Veeresh Shivashimper, Graham Smith, Ben Stephens, Mike
Stimson, Yuree Tchong, Stuart Thomson, John Wadsworth, Ian Watch,
Sarah Williams, Jason Zhu.
If you’re not on this list and think you should be, please let me know,
and accept my apologies.
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479 comments
Ioannis Mourtsiadis
14th March 2018, 7:02 am
Hi,
It was worth waiting for
Congratulations!!
Ioannis
http://www.pimodules.com
Alan Mc (Irish Framboise)
14th March 2018, 7:04 am
Wow. Oh Hap-Pi Day! Onwards & Upwards Raspberry Pi. Nice
surprise waking up this morning =oD Hope to quickly get my
hands on one here in France. Bravo.
The Raspberry Pi Guy
14th March 2018, 7:05 am
Great Pi Day news!
I’ve taken a look at the new Pi here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0keOYRbsvxc
Andrew
14th March 2018, 7:34 pm
Just to clarify a point you made in your video about 5GHz wi-fi –
802.11ac is NOT required for 5GHz support. My old laptop,
which doesn’t even support 802.11n (only a, b and g) will
happily talk to my new broadband router in the 5GHz band
using 802.11g. You can also do 802.11n on the 5GHz band.
Tomi
15th March 2018, 4:23 pm
It talks 802.11a at 5 GHz not 802.11g.
Kabelo Thomo
14th March 2018, 7:13 am
Congratulations from the pi-top team, we are excited about the
new features! Happy Pi Day!!!
Bozo Hudopisk
14th March 2018, 7:13 am
Great job!
Louis Parkerson
14th March 2018, 7:18 am
I want one… no I need one!
Spud Murphy
14th March 2018, 7:19 am
Really waiting for them to add some eMMC storage like the Tinket
Board, that would make the Pi the best value out there.
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 7:52 am
That would increase the price too much for only a tiny benefit
for the vast majority of Pi customers.
Gary Wood
14th March 2018, 12:37 pm
Yep, really need a version that includes storage this is the only
reason im not buying any more pi’s until they do(i have 3 P1,
P2, P2+).
aRBemo
14th March 2018, 1:33 pm
I looked into this but doesn’t odder much speed advantage over
and SSD but I’ll grant you they’re more compact.
aRBemo
14th March 2018, 1:33 pm
offer not odder
W. H. Heydt
14th March 2018, 2:24 pm
Short answer…get a CM3 or a NEC “CM3-16”.
Spud Murphy
14th March 2018, 7:20 am
Sorry, Tinker Board!
Peter Jones
14th March 2018, 7:27 am
Great work guys. Thank you for this. I would have liked 2GB, but
at this price point the Raspberry Pi is unbeatable!
Chad Kingsley
14th March 2018, 7:45 pm
Need more RAM.. With all the upgrades and improvements why
not add more RAM. At lease 2GB would have been better that
1. Making it 64bit and not adding more RAM Just seems like a
waste :( Don’t get me wrong, the new specs. are A++, and can
think of many more projects, just please add more RAM to the
next iteration. Thanks All and Happy Pi Day :)
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 8:22 pm
Not possible with this iteration of the SoC. 1GB is the limit.
See Eben’s posts above.
Matze
14th March 2018, 7:29 am
Is the black dot on the heat spreader a hole or is it just printed on
it?
If it is a hole you probably can’t cover it with a heatsink, can you?
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 7:52 am
Sticker.
wololo
14th March 2018, 9:01 am
i read that u cant cover it with a heatsink bc they changed the
cpu size. but i don’t know if it’s still necessary to cover it with
an heatsink.
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 9:26 am
Heatsinks will work fine, but the new thermal management
means they are less necessary for most tasks.
js
19th March 2018, 2:05 am
Got mine today, it’s definitely a hole.
Can’t easily tell if what I see through it is die or encapsulant.
I’m assuming it’s there to either allow for thermal expansion, or
simply for filling underneath the heatspreader with encapsulant.
James Carroll
14th March 2018, 7:36 am
I just happened to be up late and trolling on twitter when I saw the
news. I hit up Pimoroni and ordered 2 of them before they could
run out. One for Amibian and one for my Libreelec box. I wonder
how much difference this will make on playing x265 video. Thanks
for the update!
Rainer S.
14th March 2018, 11:47 am
+1
I would love to have hardware support for x265
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 1:59 pm
Software support is available.
Guenter Kreidl (gkreidl)
14th March 2018, 7:37 am
Will the new firmware for the BCM2837B0 become also available
as a Jessie upgrade? I’d like to replace my Pi2 systems with the
3B+, but for a number of reasons they still have to use Jessie.
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 7:55 am
The firmware should work with Jessie. I’m not sure we’ll be
doing an “official” update though.
Guenter Kreidl (gkreidl)
14th March 2018, 8:02 am
Please consider to make it available via apt-get upgrade.
This would make it very easy to replace the boards of
working Jessie systems
Simon Long
14th March 2018, 8:17 am
We’re not supporting Jessie any more, so we won’t be
releasing Jessie images or updating the Jessie apt repo.
However, while we’ve not tested it, you should be able to
apply the new firmware to a Jessie image by running rpi-
update. I’d recommend taking a backup first…
Jonas
14th March 2018, 7:42 am
Great work! I’m going to order one as soon as I finished writing
this comment! Also I like the news about a 3A+, I suppose it will be
able to act like an ethernet gadget like the Pi Zero? Will it also
have Wifi/Bluetooth?
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 7:54 am
It’s not a well-defined product yet, but the assumption is that it
would have some sort of wireless, and a single USB port that
could be made to work in gadget mode (small issue about the
OTG ID pin, but probably resolvable).
Mikael
14th March 2018, 7:43 am
Is it passive or active PoE?
Phil
14th March 2018, 8:51 am
+1
Also, are you implementing PoE with a floating ground? I
assume not given somebody is bound to attach the Pi to
something with ground tied to Earth.
Riccardo Moretti
14th March 2018, 9:04 am
is there a simple reset button on the POE 802.3 Af Hat?
and did you manage to find a wiring route path for the FM
antenna ?
Andy
14th March 2018, 9:12 am
A somewhat related question; The ‘reduced schematics’ do not,
as far as I can tell, include the PoE header and connections.
Is that a mishap or a deliberate omission?
Alex
14th March 2018, 10:57 am
How muuch will the PoE HAT cost?!
Jonathan Pallant
14th March 2018, 7:46 am
Looks like a really nice set of improvements. Well done!
How gutted were you to not have it out two weeks ago? You must
have been bursting to tell everyone in that Pi History round up
blog :)
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 7:53 am
Would have been great, but the volumes weren’t there, so it
would have been a paper launch.
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 7:53 am
But, but, but……It’s Pi Day!
Charles Dibsdale
14th March 2018, 7:50 am
Great news – thank you, what a wonderful achievement.
Marcin Zając
14th March 2018, 8:01 am
2gb and 64-128 gb of internal storage and all computer classes in
high schools across the planet will run raspbian. Just a small hint
;)
Hacker X
15th March 2018, 6:32 am
The storage shouldn’t matter for computer classes at all. That is
EXACTLY the kind of scenario that network booting is beautiful
for.
The RAM really can’t be helped until they switch from videocore
4 to 5 because a single gigabyte is the maximum VC4 can
address. And no you shouldn’t get your hopes up too far
because there have been no official announcements that a
switch is even in a roadmap anywhere. It is just a somewhat
assumed thing that it will happen at some point when the silicon
is ready at a price point that is right for the foundation.
In the meantime you can really accomplish an amazing amount
of tasks with “only” 1 gig of RAM when you take out a lot of the
bloat so many modern systems use just to make things pretty
instead of adding functionality.
There are a lot of use that still have childlike wonder and a
certain giddiness seeing how much hardware they keep
throwing at us for 35 dollars. It isn’t all that long ago when you
couldn’t even find a computer with a 64 bit CPU let alone a
multicore one and even in the early 2000’s a gig of RAM on a
desktop was a pretty big deal.
Go back a decade before that and I know from experience that
a 33MHz 486 with 8MB of RAM and a 330 MB hard drive, a
video card with 2 MB of RAM, a soundcard with 16 bit audio, a
2X CD-ROM (a big deal at the time), and a 17 inch CRT cost
around 2,500 dollars. It was also the same approximate size
and weight as a 5 or 6 year old child.
I mean really stop and think about it. This is a whole computer
small enough to fit in a drive bay of a desktop.
Douglas
17th March 2018, 7:12 am
To use a modern web browser, you need about 1.5 GB of
RAM to view sites without video. An extra 512MB or RAM
would make the Pi suitable for everyday use as a computer
(if you’re using a USB hard drive).
Of course, I think the memory requirements of the likes of
Firefox and Chrome are insane, but that’s just the way things
are at the moment for browsers that support
JavaScript/ECMAScript which the vast majority of sites
require to function.
James Hughes
17th March 2018, 5:21 pm
I agree. Insane to require 1.5GB just to display a website.
Ton van Overbeek
14th March 2018, 8:02 am
You need the Stretch release from 2018-03-13 for the B3+.
Previous releases do not work (result in 8 flashes after the
rainbow screen).
(Thanks to PiSupply I have a review model)
Ober
14th March 2018, 8:02 am
Great work and good improvements! Keep it up and I guess we
will see Raspberry Pi 4 by next year?
JPW
14th March 2018, 8:06 am
Great evolutionary change ! Love the etched metal bits as well.
Faster networking (I presume) make this a good candidate for
making WiFi hotspot / router projects. Nice one !
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 2:07 pm
It’s a nice balanced design for wireless/wired bridge products
now. I’m using one as a hotspot and wireless NAS, for which the
USB 2.0 storage bandwidth is perfectly adequate.
Dan Tat
14th March 2018, 8:07 am
This is a nice upgrade! Just wondering though… Since the gigabit
ethernet is over USB 2.0, I’m assuming there is still only one USB
bus right? So if I connect a USB hard drive and try streaming from
the Pi over a wired network, it will cut the throughput in half, right?
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 9:28 am
Not sure about half, but yes, the USB bandwidth is shared.
amin seraj
14th March 2018, 8:11 am
I love you guys. thank you for you are.
Mostafa
14th March 2018, 8:16 am
Very Good news. Does it support Windows 10 IOT Core as
previous version of Raspberry pi
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:55 am
Microsoft are working to add B+ support to IoT Core at the
moment.
Jose Cerrejon
14th March 2018, 8:17 am
Amazing! Enjoy the Pi day with a new RPi. Thank you all for made
what the Maker word means.
@ulysess10 from your blog about the Pi in english/spanish
http://misapuntesde.com
Tinker
14th March 2018, 8:19 am
Still throttled by the USB2 bus though. Now if it had USB3,
ethernet could be 1000Mb/s and SSD would work at a realistic
speed and make a superb desktop machine. I know, it defeats the
original objective of a simple machine for schools and the like.
Ruben De Smet
14th March 2018, 9:40 am
If you want such a machine, the Odroid XU4 at does all of that.
Bruce Tulloch
14th March 2018, 8:23 am
The eagle has landed. Well done guys!
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:56 am
Thanks Bruce. Appreciate the help.
nagisa
14th March 2018, 8:25 am
So, you use this Broadcom chip to power Raspberry Pi, but is
there anywhere datasheet containing the electrical properties of
the chip?
You should not connect *any* peripheral to any of the pins without
knowing the load these pins could sustain. And such information,
which would otherwise be a part of the electrical specifications in
the datasheet, doesn’t seem to be public.
Would you honour the warranty request if an user puts a 500mA
load on a pin that can only sustain 50mA and fries the whole
thing?
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 9:30 am
The published datasheet contains the data you seem to think is
missing.
nagisa
14th March 2018, 11:20 am
Could you please link to the data sheet?
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 11:41 am
https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/hardware/rasp
berrypi/bcm2835/BCM2835-ARM-Peripherals.pdf
AndrewS
14th March 2018, 12:44 pm
There’s also http://www.scribd.com/doc/101830961 if you
want even more details.
Riccardo Moretti
14th March 2018, 8:26 am
Are the reset jumpers in place and soldered in?
I found it very difficult soldering those pins.
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:57 am
No, we have not fitted pins to the reset and power-enable
holes.
Parsa
14th March 2018, 8:34 am
Great news.
as I understand from this post, the Bluetooth chip has been
replaced, am I right?
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:58 am
That’s correct. CYW43438 has been replaced with CYW43455.
Pradeep Madhavu
14th March 2018, 8:36 am
Looking forward to getting this in India at the earliest.
Vdub
14th March 2018, 8:36 am
Does this use a 5.1v or 5v power supply?
Gordon Hollingworth
14th March 2018, 10:24 am
Use the Official Raspberry Pi power supply and you can’t go
wrong…
Mark Daniels
14th March 2018, 12:23 pm
Hi Gordon, we can’t all use the official PSU in our industrial
applications. My applications use a DIN rail mounted PSU
rated at 5V 2A. I cannot use a plug-in PSU for compliance
and engineering reasons. The general specification that we
assume on 5V regulated rails is +/-5% and we expect all
connected equipement to be able to accept this. TTL logic
chips are similarly rated. It would be helpful if you could
provide an official tolerance for the 5V supply to the Pi 3B+.
Many thanks.
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 2:12 pm
That’s useful feedback. Informally, what matters is the
supply’s minimum voltage under high, and rapidly varying
load. Limits:
– our voltage throttle cuts in and drops the CPU speed at
4.6V
– many USB devices need at least 4.5V
– our PMIC shuts down at 4V
So a very stable 4.75V supply is preferable to a poorly
regulated 5.2V. The official power supply is “special”
because it has a slightly boosted zero-load voltage, good
regulation under varying load, and thick wire (I kid you not)
to minimise cable losses.
Mark Daniels
14th March 2018, 4:38 pm
Thanks, Eben. You have provided the information that I
need in our application and I am sure others will be
pleased to see this. Perhaps it could be put on your site
somewhere in the specs for the Pi.
I totally agree with your statements regarding the upper
and lower values, but we aim for high (5.1 V) as the only
cable we can get with a micro-USB plug fitted is rather
thin! We keep it very short ;) I know what you mean
about the thickness of the cable on the official PSU and
wish we could get a better cable. I don’t suppose you
could offer one?
AndrewS
14th March 2018, 6:24 pm
I’ve never done any tests or measurements, but these
seem to work quite well
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01GJIZT9I/
Bruce Tulloch
15th March 2018, 2:44 am
Mark, if mounting them like this works for you, blades offer
regulated supplies that meet the necessary specs:
http://uk.farnell.com/bitscope-blade
Michael Horne
14th March 2018, 8:37 am
Congratulations to all involved. It’s lovely to have the incremental
upgrade to the 3, especially the improved CPU speed and wifi
capabilities. :-)
Matt Hawkins
14th March 2018, 8:38 am
Great news. The signs were all there! Once the shops all started
doing “maintenance” on their websites I knew what was coming. I
wrote a blog post and guessed the spec. The only thing I had to
edit was the generous 2GB RAM I had added :)
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 11:00 am
I think 2GB of RAM at will need to wait a while: RAM prices are
incredibly high at the moment, and remain on an upward
trajectory.
crumble
14th March 2018, 12:48 pm
Does this mean that there is no VC3 limit in the near future?
Some people will pay more for a 4GB DDR 3/4 version ;)
Or are there other hardware limits as well? Like the power
consumption?
Got it!
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Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 2:13 pm
There are limitations to the SoC architecture which cap us
at 1GB. These are in theory fixable, but we’ve not
prioritised that while RAM remains so expensive.
Dr Shaun Marrison
14th March 2018, 8:49 am
So much for the environment…. QUOTE: “Note that Raspberry Pi
3B+ does consume substantially more power than its
predecessor.”
Simon Long
14th March 2018, 9:03 am
…in exchange for providing substantially more computing power
to the user.
When you run a chip faster, it uses more power – that’s
something of a physical law, and not really our fault!
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 9:32 am
And note the Pi Zero is still available, which using the much
less hungry bcm2835 processor, so you have an option the
save the world right there.
Daniel
14th March 2018, 11:18 am
Is there a way to lower the power consumption by
programmatically setting a (substantially) lower core
frequency? That would be green!
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 2:17 pm
Yes. Some recent discussion of this topic here:
https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?
t=139013
bensimmo
14th March 2018, 3:08 pm
It also needs to be taken in context.
*substantially more* on not exactly a lot for a computer
5V/<2A (<10W). Normally less than 1W in use with bits and
bobs attached jsut now with an extra WiFi adaptor, keyboard
and mouse, hdmi, SenseHat. Apt updating is averaging
around 400mA, peaking at a bit over 500mA
Probably talking ~1W more max at the wall than before ?
My graphics card idles in my PC (budget GPU) at not much
less than a fully loaded Pi stretch to the full and uses
substantially more (6/7times) when in use.
GekkePrutser
15th March 2018, 6:14 pm
According to this it’s about 1W more idle and 2W more
under load: https://www.raspberrypi.org/magpi/wp-
content/uploads/2018/03/Raspberry-Pi-Benchmarks-
Power-Draw.jpg which is a significant increase.
But yes the added speed is nice too.
Michael Macek
14th March 2018, 8:50 am
Great news,
what about HW HEVC/h.265 support? This starting to be issue in
countries with DVB-T2/HEVC – Germany, Czech Republic and
other will follow (i.e. Italy and others)
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 9:35 am
This is a point release, so a gradual improvement over the
previous model. Putting in something like HEVC HW would
require a new SoC. However, you can do software decode of
HEVC, not sure of the maximum resolution possible though.
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 11:04 am
We can play much of the 1080p HEVC content that’s out in
the wild at the moment (including 10-bit). Our “software”
implementation has a generous dose of GPU-acceleration
magic, and we’ve invested heavily in NEON optimisation.
Mike Kranidis
14th March 2018, 12:16 pm
IS there any good howto to follow in order to get H.265
playback running? What I need to do? What is the
supporting player ( VLC? ) etc. Please guide me!
Thanks
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 2:20 pm
For maximum current HEVC performance, you’ll want
Milhouse’s nightly Kodi builds here:
https://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=298461
Shane Deconinck
14th March 2018, 8:54 am
The throughput improvements are so valuable for us :)
Great work!
Martin
14th March 2018, 8:59 am
Will it be possible to easily solder an u.FL connector to have an
external WLAN/Bluetooth antenna?
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 11:05 am
I’m sure someone will find a way, but this isn’t something we
could officially support, as it has serious effects on RF
compliance.
Martin
14th March 2018, 12:40 pm
well on the zero w there’s at least a footprint and 0 ohm
resistor available. from the pictures here I couldn’t verify if it’s
the case for the 3B+
Richard Ahlquist
14th March 2018, 3:01 pm
After looking at the bottom picture from Farnell’s site I can
tell you the point people were using before to mount U.FL
connectors is gone. Will be interesting to see if someone
comes up with an alternative.
Richard Ahlquist
14th March 2018, 3:36 pm
Ok did a bit of digging. The FCC docs show the on board
antenna and if you ask me it looks like at U.FL could be
mounted there.
https://apps.fcc.gov/eas/GetApplicationAttachment.html?
id=3777866 last page of the document.
Martin
15th March 2018, 7:31 am
thanks Richard
unfortunately the linked document is not publicly
available…
Martin
15th March 2018, 7:38 am
ok, when coming from
https://apps.fcc.gov/oetcf/eas/reports/ViewExhibitReport
.cfm?
mode=Exhibits&RequestTimeout=500&calledFromFram
e=N&application_id=7%2BPBWcwWYoF9sodjFQpcWw
%3D%3D&fcc_id=2ABCB-RPI3BP clicking on External
Photos opens the mentioned link
Raymond Richmond
16th March 2018, 2:32 pm
While I’m sure the RF compliance exercise would be a
challenge it is high on our want list here at a University. We
have challenging RF spaces and a mandated “single service”
wireless infrastructure and the on-PCB antenna just doesn’t
cut it. Being able to connect external antenna(e) would make
the RPi much more enticing to many researchers and build
clubs here.
James Hughes
16th March 2018, 2:57 pm
It simply isn’t going to happen. It’s a compliance nightmare,
and would require us to supply a known tested antenna
with every model. So expensive as well. The problem isn’t
the Pi, it’s your environment.
Nuno Silva
18th March 2018, 2:54 am
I’m sure it would be easy to find some very cheap
antenna to provide as tested antenna… even if not a
good one due to price, hardly it would be worst (and
avoid internal interferences) than a pcb mounted
antenna… and would give user the chance to replace it
to a better one, if user wants!
Please re-think on this for the future… Thanks.
James Hughes
18th March 2018, 10:46 am
Even a cheap antenna increases the cost of the Pi for
everyone, even if the huge majority don’t need one. And
the FCC compliance things really is a nightmare. I really
cannot see it happening at least for the next few models.
Steve Davies
14th March 2018, 9:04 am
Well done again!
Simplicity and common sense appear to be your ‘super powers’.
Fighting the urge of “I must have one… my precious”, expect to
succumb soon.
Levente
14th March 2018, 9:23 am
Will be able the new model to play UDH/4K videos (using e.g.
Libreelec/Kodi)?
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 11:06 am
This is still a 1080p-class device. We can however play a lot of
the 1080p HEVC content that’s out there.
Dave Semmelink
14th March 2018, 9:23 am
I can’t wait to get one! Sadly, here in South Africa we have to wait
for ICASA approval before they can be imported (legally). It took
them 7 weeks to approve the Pi Zero W.
Just to be clear: the 300Mb/s Ethernet is only going to work with
1Gb/s switches and cable, right?
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 9:34 am
It will work with switches UPTO that speed. So should be
entirely backwards compatible, but will obviously run at the
speed of the slowest switch.
Mike Redrobe
14th March 2018, 10:25 am
Well it *is* a physical gigabit ethernet interface after all. It’s a
bit coy calling it 330MBit just because it’s restricted by USB2.
I guess that’s just to head off the trolls.
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 11:07 am
You read my mind :)
JacoR
5th August 2018, 6:24 am
And we are still waiting for approval.
Neil Stoker
14th March 2018, 9:24 am
Superb work Eben and co!
If I’ve got an up-to-date Jesse Lite SD card from a Pi3 B, will it
work straight away if swapped into a B+?
Ton van Overbeek’s comment suggests it would if new enough. I’d
got my image installed before the date he gave, but have updated
it with apt-get as per here, so am guessing it would be fine,
although confirmation would be much appreciated.
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 11:08 am
As Simon has said elsewhere in the comments, we’d expect you
to be able to rpi-update a Jessie image with current B+-
compatible firmware. Taking a backup first might be advisable.
Timo Albert
14th March 2018, 9:34 am
How high is the heat spreader of the cpu in comparison to the
metal shield of the wireless circuity?
Can i place a wide cooler on top of the cpu without interfering with
the metal shield?
Scenario:
I’m using my Pi3 inside a case from WDLabs (the flat one)
together with a 2TB usb hdd. The temperatures inside the case
(hdd + RasPi) forced me to add a massive cooling solution and i
had to add a copper plate to the CPU in order do get the actual
cooler high enough above the circuit board to avoid any contact to
the components on the board. cooling is still passive as the cooler
is cut to fit in between 40pin header and all the other higher parts
on the board.
If the heat spreader on the Pi3B+ CPU is high enough, i could go
without a copper spacer…
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 9:51 am
Thermal management is a LOT more efficient on the 3B+, using
the PCB to move heat away from the processor as well as the
cap. You *might* get away with no heatsink, but you will need to
try it in your particular enclosure.
Timo Albert
14th March 2018, 11:50 am
I appreciate your answer, but i doubt that i will get away
without.
While the look of my WDLabs case is pretty nice, the thermal
conditions are far from optimal. Air is trapped inside the case
and a hdd and raspi under full load in summer heat up pretty
quick. Only after applying a cooler taken from an old passive
cooled graphics card i got rid of chronic overheating (at least
of my RasPi, never checked hdd temp).
So my question remains: Is the cpu heat spreader higher
than the wireless metal shield?
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 1:59 pm
Quick look, they appear to be the same height. Note that
the PCB itself is now acting as a heatsink, and pumping
heat down the wired connectors, so the thermal dissipation
capability is much higher than the 3B.
PeterF
15th March 2018, 4:19 pm
This thermal design appears to work very well. A short
power-on time (enough to do a quick goods-in check)
and the USB sockets and ethernet socket shrouds are
all warm to the touch. As are the GPIO pins. I guess
they’re all acting as little radiators (convectors). Perhaps
we won’t need a heatsink now in a standard case?
Thanks for the attention to detail!
SILVERLINE ELECTRONICS
14th March 2018, 9:36 am
Congragulations , it was a very exciting wait, very eager for it to
come to India.:)
gregeric
14th March 2018, 9:46 am
Looking at the hi-res photo clickable above, those vias look weird.
Where’s the drill hole gone?
Gordon Hollingworth
14th March 2018, 10:26 am
Boards with fricken lasers dude…
AndrewS
14th March 2018, 11:45 am
…and along similar lines, what are the weird solder-blobs
between the LAN7515 and the Ethernet socket?
PaulG
15th March 2018, 10:09 pm
Those sites would be for EMC/ESD diode packs. They give
the ethernet PHI device added protection for any extreme
pick-up on very long ethernet cables, or installations in noisy
environments. I’m not familiar with the ethernet IC used here,
but they were probably dropped for cost reasons. I’m more
intrigued by the 45degree placement of these and the 1(!)
capacitor on this board.
Louis Slabbert
14th March 2018, 10:00 am
Looking forward to getting my hands on the new RPi 3b+ and the
PoE HAT. Do you have an expected release date for the Power
over Ethernet HAT? I can see a lot of uses when you don’t need to
have a power socket nearby. It will even spark me to create videos
again on my Youtube channel
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCculiYijgl1qXy6u51d6Ddw
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 11:09 am
We have all the components to build our first 20k in hand, so
we’re literally just waiting for a manufacturing slot. Late April if
we’re lucky, early to mid May more likely.
Luke Skaff
14th March 2018, 10:00 am
I have read the limitations of faster preformance and less power
from the processor is the 40nm node size which is very old. Why
can’t they go to a smaller process?
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 10:05 am
Moving to a new process is a painful and time consuming job,
with no guarantee it will work without major changes to the
silicon. So not a trivial task.
Eben has stated that we have pretty much reached the limit of
the current process.
jax
14th March 2018, 10:06 am
35 dollar?? Not here in the Netherlands. The cheapest I can find it
is 49 dollar including shipping. Not worth it.
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 10:21 am
Try some of the UK suppliers who will ship to the Netherlands,
probably cheaper.
Helen Lynn
14th March 2018, 10:23 am
It’s plus local taxes and shipping, which of course vary quite a
bit according to the locality; that said, the total you mention is
within pennies of the cost of a 3B+, shipped, in the UK.
jax
14th March 2018, 10:31 am
I think I’ll wait till they are sold through AlieExpress. Buying
there and having it shipped from China to the Netherlands is
usually ( a lot) cheaper then having it send to me from the
local warehouse down the street, so to speak.
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 10:51 am
Cheaper because you are avoiding paying the tax you
should be paying. There should be import duty applied,
and whatever the Dutch equivalent of VAT is. Buying from
Aliexpress is avoiding that, so you are in effect giving
money to China (the profit) instead of your home country
(profit and tax).
David
15th March 2018, 2:29 pm
The Dutch equivalent of VAT is VAT; however, as the
Dutch have an even more creative approach to
abbreviations than the French, they spell it BTW
(Belasting Toegevoegde Waarde or Tax Added Value).
Just in case you really wanted to know :-)
Michel
15th March 2018, 6:38 pm
Pollin in Germany sells it for 36,50 Euro. (ex shipping)
Douglas
14th March 2018, 10:07 am
I was really hoping for a 2GB model… I honestly would have
preferred more RAM over a faster network port and even a faster
CPU… Bluetooth? Who is even using Bluetooth with these boards
anyway? In any case, I’ll hold out until they have a new model with
more RAM, and the same power demands as the original Pi 3 or
Pi 2.
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 10:25 am
Well, more RAM would require a new SoC, so rather out of the
remit of this gradual upgrade.
People do use Bluetooth, you know the Pi3 has BT, don’t you,
so that capability hasn’t changed.
As for power demands – if you want a faster processor, or more
RAM, or faster networking, then the power requirements go up.
You cannot change the laws of physics. So please don’t expect
any future models to use less power. We are not Scotty.
Helen Lynn
14th March 2018, 10:41 am
“Dammit, Jim, they’re engineers, not magicians.”
mjw
14th March 2018, 12:10 pm
RAM is incredibly expensive right now. And be thankful that
these aren’t good for crypto-mining.
Michael
21st March 2018, 8:56 am
Sorry a bit late with this comment. But I happily use bluetooth.
My PI sits behind the TV and it’s running retro-pi+kodi, I control
it using a PS3 bluetooth controller and it all works wonderfully.
So I was happy to have the onboard bluetooth support. On
previous PI models I was using a bluetooth dongle and setting it
up was much more painful (same with having the onboard wifi,
made things much easier).
Özgür
29th March 2018, 9:00 pm
“Who’s even using bluetooth with these boards anyway?”
-Tens of thousands of people all around the world, who are
using Retropie/Recalbox on Raspberry Pi, with their bluetooth
game controllers/joysticks?
Brendan
14th March 2018, 10:09 am
Congrats on the new Pi 3+. I’m looking forward to using one in the
future especially with the new 5Ghz Wi-Fi capabilities. Though i
am wondering if there has been a solution to the issue of the Pi
being unable to connected to an enterprise network i.e. one that
requires account and password as i would love to use it in
university but unfortunately cannot connect to the Wi-Fi.
pssc
14th March 2018, 12:29 pm
Pi’s can be connected to Eduroam WiFi(WPA2 peap with
mschapv2) with username and password with a correct config.
fnord
14th March 2018, 12:39 pm
wpa-supplicant which Raspbian uses has no problems
whatsoever connecting to a WPA2 Enterprise network, but you
may have to configure it manually.
Jos
14th March 2018, 10:13 am
“Improved PXE network and USB mass-storage booting”
What is improved about USB mass-storage booting?
Gordon Hollingworth
14th March 2018, 10:29 am
Some of the fixes implemented for USB MSD booting and
Ethernet booting got rolled into the bootrom. So should support
a few more drives…
Piglet
15th March 2018, 11:50 am
OOh! Does that mean I might finally be able to ditch the sd
boot card and USB boot successfully directly from my WD Pi-
Drive more often than the 1 in 20 times I get now?
AndrewS
15th March 2018, 8:12 pm
I’ve just successfully booted a fresh-out-of-the-box Pi 3B+
from a microSD card in a USB card-reader plugged into
one of the Pi’s USB ports (with nothing in the Pi’s microSD
card slot) :-) Very cool.
W. H. Heydt
19th March 2018, 12:54 am
Odd…I’ve never had any problems booting a Pi3B (and
now a Pi3B+) directly from a PiDrive. Indeed, within 5
minutes of opening the Pi3B+ box, I had it swapped into
the case in place of a Pi3B and it booted right up from the
PiDrive. (I did an update/upgrade cycle earlier in the day,
so it was ready to go.)
What I need to test is to see what effect the new release of
Raspbian has when setting up a CM3L in a WD SATA
Adapter. That I’ve had problems with.
Peter Wenger
14th March 2018, 10:16 am
So how much more power does it need, in which situation, and
can the power usage be reduced if not a lot of CPU power is
needed all the time?
zmlopez
14th March 2018, 10:17 am
Great work with this design, I would look forward to see compute
modules with this processor (and Wifi/BT included version), but…
“Yes. VideoCore IV 3D is the only publicly-documented 3D
graphics core for ARM‑based SoCs, and we want to make
Raspberry Pi more open over time, not less.”
Open?
There isn’t a datasheet of the processor, with a lot of features
undocumented, like for example, DPI ports.
There isn’t even complete schematics of the board available. I
don’t understand why: nobody could copy your product, as you
don’t sell the processor to anyone.
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 10:28 am
Full release of SoC datasheets is down to Broadcom, because
they are the processor designers/manufacturers, not us. We do
have a cut down one available.
https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/hardware/raspberry
pi/bcm2835/BCM2835-ARM-Peripherals.pdf
Partial schematics are available here.
https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/hardware/raspberry
pi/schematics/README.md
W. H. Heydt
19th March 2018, 12:58 am
*Anyone* can buy the SoCs….so long as they are willing (and
able) to commit to buying enough of them.
Jerry Wasinger
14th March 2018, 10:23 am
WoW!
Don Isenstadt
14th March 2018, 10:26 am
Congratulations! Another great pi server for my pi zeros to connect
to!
Bernardo
14th March 2018, 10:26 am
Can you do also a Zero on Steroids? The Zero Form factor but
with the processor and memory of the 3+
Callum Hendry
14th March 2018, 10:33 am
You’ve gone and done it again…thanks Raspberry_Pi, you’ve
made my π Day :) In context these are significant upgrades, but
doing so without increase in price and not even trying to capitalise
on what could have been marketed as Pi4 is a touch of class. Well
done everyone! Bit out there but is there scope to build in the
capacity for a wireless casting of a virtual desktop? Perhaps to a
chromecast-esque dongle? Best of both worlds with a headless
setup which still allows use of a graphical interface, and of course
v portable.
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 10:47 am
Casting is pretty much a SW issue. I sure some people have got
Miracast working.
Callum Hendry
14th March 2018, 11:55 am
Thanks, I’ll investigate Miracast. Ideally, what I would like
ascertain if it’s possible to mirror the Pi desktop or video
output to another device over WiFi? I appreciate that it is a
software issue to a point, however is it not possible that if a
receiver HDMI/USB dongle could receive the broadcasted
visual, with a universal design to enable portability and out-
of-the-box connectivity?
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 1:21 pm
Does VNC not do what you want? That can work over any
sort of network connection.
roman1528
14th March 2018, 10:56 am
And NO IP.X / UF.L connector… you learned nothing in the past…
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 1:24 pm
Adding that connector would mean we have to supply an
antenna otherwise we would not be able to get any sort of FCC
compliance and would not be able to sell the product at all. Too
expensive, a cost that would be passed on to huge numbers of
people who simply don’t need the feature.
So, yes, we know exactly what we are doing. Adding that
connector would be a terrible idea.
Ioannis Mourtsiadis
14th March 2018, 10:58 am
Hi,
The new Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+, except of all other things, has
one, really very, very, important on my opinion – the Power ENable
Input.
That means you can switch the Raspberry Pi ON/OFF, directly
from your added PCB (i.e. in our case from PIco) without removing
micro USB cable or adding an external switch to it. That make the
Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+, a perfect device for embedded
applications. Now, you can fit-in your hardware to the case and
switch your application ON/OFF easy, and professionally.
Raspberry Pi Engineers, You are PERFECT designers !!
Warmest Regards
Ioannis
wwww.pimodules.com
AndrewS
14th March 2018, 11:41 am
Hmmm, looking at the reduced schematics it appears to be a
Power ENable output? Looks like a simple voltage-divider
means that it outputs 3.2V when the board is powered with 5V?
Ioannis Mourtsiadis
14th March 2018, 12:38 pm
Hi,
No. Tested on real device. Check also the IC data-sheet
used for the system powering
Warmest regards
Ioannis
http://www.pimodules.com
Paulo
14th March 2018, 5:34 pm
But the possible switch off button through new POE will
shutdown Pi correctly or just cut energy?
VeryNoob
14th March 2018, 11:40 pm
Can you tell us a little more about this? Do you just need to pull
the PEN to ground to “cut the power”? This would be great. I
can think of a few ways of using this. Something similar to the
pi-supply or an ATTiny that reads a switch and a GPIO to
determine when to cut power. Does work when powering via the
GPIO, or just when powering via USB.
Martin P
14th March 2018, 11:05 am
Why it still does not support decoder Format: H.264,H.??
4K in the 21st century ….
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 11:46 am
Full HW decode of H265 etc would require a new SoC and this
is a point release rather than a entirely new Pi. However, the
ARM cores are now capable of fairly decent decode in software.
Meanwhile, H264 still works and is a pretty decent format.
Martin P
14th March 2018, 2:30 pm
I will be interested in another raspberry when I support H.265
Gordon Hollingworth
14th March 2018, 8:01 pm
Already supports H265 1080P30, we’ve tested it with lots of
available content and it all plays fine
Go for your life!
Adam F
15th March 2018, 3:49 am
Could you clarify this? I assume this won’t work with
omxplayer since it relies on hardware support (which the Pi
doesn’t have for h265). Is there another way to play h265
media over HDMI on a *headless* Pi
James Hughes
15th March 2018, 9:41 am
Yes, we are spending considerable time and money on
optimising the H265 codec using HW blocks where we
can, and NEON as much as possible. This means that
the majority of HEVC stuff out there will work fine up to
1080p. Including 10bit. The work is still ongoing, but the
latest overnight millhouse builds of Kodi have this codec
in.
Farid
14th March 2018, 11:07 am
Wooow!
Does it support windows 10 iot core ?
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 2:25 pm
Not yet, but Microsoft are working on it.
Joe
14th March 2018, 11:23 am
I need USB 3!!!
Richard Sierakowski
14th March 2018, 11:56 am
USB2 to USB3 adaptors may help
Richard
Bob Waterson
14th March 2018, 11:35 am
Care to comment about the unfair competitive advantage you’ve
given some retailers such as Pimoroni?
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 1:28 pm
Presumably you are unfamiliar with the reseller programme?
https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/approved-reseller/
Become a approved reseller, get early access to new product.
Simples.
Brian Beuken
14th March 2018, 11:41 am
Does the GPU share in the speed boost? I don’t see any figures
for its clock speed?
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 2:32 pm
We’ve not increased the GPU clock at launch. We do have lots
of margin though, so may do so (from 400/300 to 500/400) in
due course.
Brian Beuken
14th March 2018, 9:58 pm
thanks for that, I would love to see a bit of a speed boost on
the GPU but appreciate it will increase power and heat.
Can I also ask Eben, I know its a done deal now, but was
there ever a possibility of increasing the number of cores for
the GPU? I realise graphic programming is not high on most
users list but it is on mine and I’d love to see Raspberry
systems compete with some of the multi core GPU systems?
Abu Abdulla
17th March 2018, 4:08 am
it is a welcome point release, thank you. i was looking for any
improvement in the GPU if that will support faster rendering
of the camera frames.
I hope to see also Pi 3A+ soon as it is the only small footprint
replacement for the Pi 0w which is stuck with armv6
James Hughes
17th March 2018, 5:21 pm
I doubt there will be any improvements to the camera
system for some time. What particularly is your issue?
Got it!
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Abu Abdulla
26th March 2018, 5:31 am
sorry, i missed this.
there is certainly no issue, it is just in my wish list to
stream from my camera a resolution more than the
current limited 1080p due to H264 encoder limitation.
Richard Sierakowski
14th March 2018, 11:54 am
This is an excellent and well considered evolutionary step in the
RasPi series.
Richard
nmiller
14th March 2018, 12:06 pm
I think your temperature and frequency plot is labeled backwards.
Christian Nobel
14th March 2018, 12:09 pm
“Note that Raspberry Pi 3B+ does consume substantially more
power than its predecessor.”
What exactly does that mean?
Is it possible to underclock it, in situations where all the
horsepower is not necessary, but there still is a requirement for
eg. WiFi?
Gordon Hollingworth
14th March 2018, 8:03 pm
Yes, there are settings to underclock if required (you could just
force it to powersave mode which will peg it at 600MHz). But if
you clock even lower you could undervolt as well…
Frixos Theodoulou
14th March 2018, 12:26 pm
Does this sale spread across the world? Or only in the US?
Also does this sale include the VAT or not?
The dealer here says that the product is not on sale in Europe and
it is sold at its normal price.
Christian Nobel
14th March 2018, 1:14 pm
At this moment RS here in Denmark claims to have approx
4.500 in stock, and Farnell around 8.000!
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 1:30 pm
Not quite sure what you mean by sale. This is the latest Pi
model, and is plus local taxes/P&P. And will stay at that price.
Should be available worldwide, we have made a LOT up front
so supply should be good.
AndrewS
14th March 2018, 3:02 pm
I think there’s confusion between “on sale” meaning
“available for purchase”, and “on sale” meaning “being sold
at a reduced price”.
In this article, it’s referring to the first meaning.
Niall Saunders
14th March 2018, 12:31 pm
Thanks again R-Pi Team,
I ‘knew’ that there had to be ‘something’ in your release pipeline –
and I didn’t believe that PiTowers could be shut down by ‘the
wrong kind of snow’ (as Ebene recently suggested.
So, a nice surprise to wake up to this morning, and simply the best
excuse I can think of for giving my Credit Card a gentle workout.
But, why oh why didn’t you go for an octal-core processor, running
at 4GHz, with 16Gb RAM and true Gigabit Ethernet that didn’t
compromise the USB3 bus? ;-)
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 2:33 pm
:)
jdb
14th March 2018, 4:08 pm
:)
Mandy Daniels
14th March 2018, 12:38 pm
What a coincidence that this is also Albert Einstein’s 139th
birthday and, sadly, the date of Stephen Hawking’s death. I think
he would have found a certain amusement in this.
Brandon
14th March 2018, 12:42 pm
Is that a Pickard reference from TNG?
Helen Lynn
14th March 2018, 12:49 pm
The “four pins” caption? Yes it is!
Noxmiles
14th March 2018, 10:54 pm
omg ?
Please more Star Trek references ;D
Andreas
19th March 2018, 11:21 am
I was just about to ask whether I was supposed to hear
Patrick Stewart’s voice in my head while reading that caption.
Jakub Dostál
14th March 2018, 12:49 pm
Excellent work !!!
I’m just sorry I did not wait for “PI Day” and bought 14 days ago
Raspberry Pi 3 B (without plus).
Would you like to send me a new model by post? :-)
Greetings from the Raspberry Pi Community of the Czech
Republic
leonardo lacchini
14th March 2018, 1:00 pm
gigaethernet only 300M ? mmm
Dane P
14th March 2018, 9:16 pm
Gigabit Ethernet refers to a standard for data transmission with
regards to signalling, electrical characteristics, and some other
low-level stuff. The port and the Ethernet hardware are Gigabit
Ethernet, just like most modern computers are, however the
USB bus that the NIC sits on is not actually capable of dealing
with 1Gbps of data bandwidth. That’s why they made it clear
that it was capped at 330Mbps.
This is similar to a lot of consumer routers that were on sale in
recent years. They were in the “gigabit routing class”, but the
WAN port could sometimes only sustain 300-700 Mpbs speeds.
It was a hardware limitation based on what the processor and
hardware in the router could actually handle, as opposed to a
limitation of the network hardware itself.
Networking started to become widespread with 10 Mbps
Ethernet, which was followed by 100 Mbps (Fast Ethernet),
then 1 Gbps (Gigabit Ethernet). Those numbers represent
maximum or ideal speeds, and can even be affected by
environmental conditions like EM noise or interference on
cables. But anything that’s delivering bandwidth above 100
Mbps is using the Gigabit Ethernet standard. (Unless it’s
delivering more that 1Gbps, in which case it’s 10 Gigabit
Ethernet or one of the even newer standards that provides for
2.5 Gbps and 5 Gbps connections.)
DDS Central
14th March 2018, 1:11 pm
A nice update. But still with only a gigabyte of RAM, Pi is not very
useful for general computing, no matter how much CPU grunt you
add to it.
I understand that you are trying to stick to price tag, but I would be
more than happy to pay extra money for a more substantial
hardware upgrade than this.
Pi is still way behind the competition in the hardware department.
Let’s hope that the next-gen Pi will be more capable.
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 1:34 pm
If your applications need more than 1GB, you probably need to
write better software. There are some exceptions. Not many.
Lots of people use the Pi for general computing, so your
premise seems to be wrong, and this one is even better.
As for way behind the competition, well, not sure that is true
either.
Note that moving to >1GB requires a new SOC, therefor a
COMPLETE redesign of the Pi. Very expensive, very time
consuming, and not something that would be expected at this
point in the roadmap.
Özgür
27th March 2018, 12:46 pm
You remind me of: “*640k ought to be enough for anybody*”
This is not 1981. It’s 2018 – and you’re, please, trying to talk
1GB is enough for -almost- anyone? I consider this as a joke.
I respect and agree your -technical?- reasons. However,
there are tons of people who are willing to pay more *for
extra*.
I wish, you’d at least offer a more-paid-plus-plus hardware for
people who are waiting for a >1GB Raspberry Pi.
J Osborne
5th June 2018, 5:34 pm
I dunno, I could go with it. I have 3 Raspberry Pi’s, and not
a single one of them is suffering from memory related
performance problems.
I mean, yes, I can’t take a 1G RAM Raspberry Pi and make
a great ZFS server out of it, but the 1G RAM is only part of
the problem, the lack of high speed external I/O is also a
big deal there.
You don’t get to solve all the world’s computing needs at
the price point. For the thing is fantastic.
More over 1G of RAM is more then enough for thousands
and thousands of tasks. Bumping to 2G or 4G doesn’t
really open up whole new worlds of possibilities. It just
slightly nudges a window open. Don’t get me wrong, I’m a
lazy programmer, if you want to give me 4G of RAM I’ll be
happy to take it. I just don’t see it as world shaking.
In fact for the primary mission of the Pi (providing an entry
point into CS and Entering for England’s school aged kids)
1G of RAM is far more the sufficient. After all that was
done in the 1980’s on RAM measured in K bytes. The
world has moved on, but not by so much that that same
mission can’t be accomplished with a gigabyte. I mean it
was only 2012 when 256M was sufficient for this task. Six
years hasn’t moved that bar very much, 1G has lots of
headroom for people just learning what Python and
Scratch can do. For people learning how to wire LEDs to
GPIO pins and get real world experience with hardware
modification.
I totally believe that _you_ would be willing to pay more for
more RAM, or that I would pay more for more RAM and
SATA (& I bet more RAM will come some year, but SATA is
far far less likely). I don’t think any of that is needed to
make the Pi a better educational platform, and _all_ of that
would require design and test time, would add SKUs to
manage, and increase support burdens.
(Note: I don’t speak for the foundation, I’m not employed by
them, so I’m only guessing at basically everything in here
using public knowledge, and some past life experience at
companies that design SOCs and such)
Sebastian Schmal
14th March 2018, 1:24 pm
Comming on Amazon ?
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 1:35 pm
Already available from multiple resellers worldwide – you don’t
need to wait for Amazon.
Paul M
14th March 2018, 1:34 pm
Congratulations on the delivery of your new Pi.
Thaddeus Woskowiak
14th March 2018, 1:41 pm
Why no hardware gigabit MAC? Lots of CPU cycles going down
the drain for USB -> gigabit.
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:00 pm
I don’t believe there’s a significant additional CPU load
associated with running Ethernet over USB. Of course an
onboard MAC would give us a full gigabit of bandwidth, but it
would also necessitate some more radical surgery to the SoC.
Matt
14th March 2018, 2:00 pm
Great stuff. Figures though, I just bought 20 RPi 3B for my school
2 weeks ago! Had no idea a new model was in the works.
I’ll have to pick myself one of these today.
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 2:09 pm
Sorry – we never announce stuff like this in advance I am
afraid.
W. H. Heydt
19th March 2018, 1:42 am
Moral of the story… Do Not Buy a Pi between 1 Feb. and 15
Mar. unless in the wake of a product release. I guess. Just
watch Eben release some in, oh–I don’t know–July some
time. (Yes I know there have been releases at other times of
the year, but the early Feb. to mid-March seems to be the
“sweet spot”.)
lolo
14th March 2018, 2:03 pm
Congratulations to the raspberry pi team ;)
Thanks for this welcoming update, I immediately ordered one ^^
Keep going on folks ;)
Neil
14th March 2018, 2:05 pm
Interesting to see PoE make an appearance. I’m assuming the
four-pin header is just for the four PoE lines from the Ethernet jack
and that the 5V output is fed to the board through a different
connector? I do hope you’ll be encapsulating the transformer to
stop fingers touching the 48V DC and higher switching voltages
on the transformer pins.
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 2:08 pm
As always, the PoE will adhere to all appropriate standards.
One of the reasons we don’t churn out model after model like
some competitors is that we actually bother to go through
testing procedures and make sure that products are fit for
purpose.
Neil
14th March 2018, 3:15 pm
Oh I’m sure you do James, I have no doubt ;) I remember
years ago designing a PoE product and getting tingles and
shocks off the flyback transformer. A perspex plate and a
warning sticker kept my fingers from getting zapped.
anon34534
14th March 2018, 3:34 pm
50v and lower is regarded as safe, which is why POE
ethernet cabling can be run without an electrical
permit/license. Sure you might feel a little tingle if you
touch it, but it is by no means deadly.
This is why POE standards set the voltage to around the
48v mark. It is the most efficient in regards to voltage drop
over a long cable run way to get power from the
injector/switch to the powered device without the end user
involving an electrician and permits.
Neil
14th March 2018, 4:09 pm
The behaviour of the flyback circuit could put
considerably more than 48V at one of the transformer
terminals. Use of a snubber to limit the primary-side
ringing would help with emissions.
Gordon Hollingworth
14th March 2018, 8:06 pm
Also we made sure it will all fit inside the Raspberry Pi
official case so you can protect your fingers!
Neil
15th March 2018, 9:42 am
POE comes from the telecomms world, which has
standardised on -48V DC for a variety of reasons (48V =
4 x 12V battery banks, high enough to get good signal-
to-noise, low enough not to shock linesmen up poles,
positive ground to minimise corrosion in underground
cables, etc).
Doug Bates
14th March 2018, 2:11 pm
I’m currently running a couple of Pi3B’s 24/7 for general
desktop/media stuff behind our two TVs (kitchen and lounge).
Both booting from MSD SSDs. Great, love them, thanks. One
question: When I set them up ~12 months ago I had to burn a one-
time-programmable bit in the CPU – is it now set or do I need to
repeat this stage.
Thanks again.
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:01 pm
No: now we’re more confident in the MSD and PXE boot
modes, these bits are blown by default.
infinitytec
14th March 2018, 2:14 pm
Nice job, but why still only 1GB RAM?
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 2:37 pm
RAM is going through one of its periodic price spikes. It wasn’t
feasible to add more to the design while sticking to the price
point. Don’t worry though: we’re well aware of the appetite for
more RAM, and will come back to this once prices moderate.
Petr Hajek
14th March 2018, 8:47 pm
Even server RAMs are 5-10 % up so… Trend is set more like
this up to 2019-20 I assume.
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:02 pm
I do hope not. There was some sign of moderation early
this year, but as you say it’s started to increase again.
Petr Hajek
15th March 2018, 1:54 pm
Don’t forgett that more and more gadgets share the
same memory market nad pressure for inovation: we
don’t have only PCs, notebooks, servers, today, but
tablets, smartphones, multimedia players, consoles, … I
would LOVE to be wrong, but I am realist…
Chuck Lowe
14th March 2018, 2:18 pm
WOW. You give people improvements, keep it the same price and
still get complaints! These are nicely added features. I would
suggest if they don’t meet your needs, buy a competitors product.
While not an engineer I understand the issues of adding more
RAM, USB 3.0 and dedicated Ethernet. etc. Those items cost $
and the manufacturing line process would have to be changed. I
currently have a Pi3B that I have setup as a wireless router.
(among other projects). I can’ wait to switch my micro card in the
new model, update the OS and see the results. I live in SE
Pennsylvania. Lucky enough to have a store, MicroCenter, that
sells the PI line of pc and other add ons. Its actually on my way
to/from work so I order online and pickup in store. No shipping
required. Plus they sell the Pi3B for and currently sell the Pi0W for
an incredible . They charge more for 2 or more. Don’t understand
the reasoning there. I simply place another order the next day and
pick it up for the same price. These are great features. Thanks for
them and for the support the Pi community has in general. Plus
being a programmer/analyst, DBA, etc I’m learning python coding
and enjoying it.
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:03 pm
You’re lucky to live near a Micro Center. We have nothing quite
like that in the UK. Still remember my first trip to a store in
Brooklyn, and seeing the Pi 2 on sale at …
David
14th March 2018, 2:21 pm
Awesome to see the FCC module compliance, thanks guys!
Ton van Overbeek
14th March 2018, 2:26 pm
Addition to my previous comment.
Running apt-get update/upgrade on a pre 2018-03-13 Stretch
image will make the SD-card boot on the 3B+. Of course you have
to update it on another Pi.
Just tested it. Works.
And the boot to desktop (stretch-full) is clearly faster than on the
3B.
Wayne Taylor
14th March 2018, 2:27 pm
This is awesome. Purchase 1 just to support you guys. I will find a
use for it, always do. :-)
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:03 pm
Thanks for your custom :)
Ali S
14th March 2018, 2:36 pm
Hi,
We would like to become distributors/ resellers for the Florida
region. Can you direct me to your distributor sign up program?
https://www.usdistributor.net
Thanks,
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 2:59 pm
Please email info@raspberrypi.org for details of our approved
reseller program.
Mark
14th March 2018, 2:39 pm
Is the TF/SD card controller any faster?
Richard Collins
14th March 2018, 7:23 pm
I would know this too. There are also issues with hitting the
USB hard and the SDCARD at the same time.
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:04 pm
We’ve not increased the speed of the SD interface. Would be
interested in hearing more about the issues you’ve been
having with SD and USB together.
Ultraz
14th March 2018, 2:47 pm
Great news! The main question is how much will it cost?
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:05 pm
I’m guessing plus tax and shipping.
Richard Ahlquist
14th March 2018, 2:49 pm
Any photos of the underside of the board?
Dean Woodyatt
14th March 2018, 3:03 pm
POE – IOT, here we come!!
Super excited about this…we should start to see many more
monitoring devices now a sensibly priced POE is an option……..
Having those power pins ‘broken out’ like that into the network
adaptor will also allow much more ‘fun’ to be had with inventive
ways of just ‘one cable in’ type solutions, not just POE…
this is the one we’ve been waiting for!
Vincent
14th March 2018, 3:08 pm
Hi !
As always when there’s a new Pi, my dreaded question: does this
one has a real GIC or are you still using the old and ugly interrupt
controller from the pi (I need a GIC for a better secure interrupt
management in trustzone :D)
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:06 pm
Old it is, though I prefer “beautifully simple” to “ugly”.
Vincent
15th March 2018, 7:59 am
Dully noted, thanks for the info ;)
Mike Redrobe
14th March 2018, 3:15 pm
Can the new and improved power circuitry give us a low power
standby ?
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:10 pm
Yes. The unpopulated PEN (power enable) header allows you
to take down the PMIC. There’s probably scope to create a HAT
with a microcontroller that puts the whole Pi into an ultra-low-
power state. More on this in a future post.
Mike Redrobe
17th March 2018, 1:32 pm
Thanks – managed to get something working on that pre
documentation – 11 mA shutdown:
https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?
f=63&t=207961
MyCtenophore
14th March 2018, 3:17 pm
Enclosures have not been mentioned. Please tell us about
compatibility of the new Pi with existing / older enclosures.
Simon Long
14th March 2018, 4:30 pm
It fits the official Raspberry Pi Case for the Model 3. It will
probably fit most third party cases, as the board is the same
size and connectors are in the same places, but we can’t make
any guarantees – for example, it doesn’t fit the PiBow case; I
believe the PoE connector is positioned where a part of the
case goes.
anon34534
14th March 2018, 3:27 pm
I’ll get excited when I can get my hands on one at the MSRP of in
9 months to a year.
I really wish the PI foundation would rein in their re-sellers for the
1st few months after a release and limit sales to one per customer
and outright BAN the practice of bundling them in “starter packs”.
These “starter packs” are just full of crap the seasoned PI user
does not need. If a re-seller wanted to make the starter pack
contents minus the PI a separate line item that gets a discount
with purchase of a PI, I would be fine with that.
One would think that after this many product launches, they would
have a clue what the demand is for these products and have a
reasonable number of them available on launch date that they
don’t all sell out within an hour or less.
Simon Long
14th March 2018, 4:28 pm
“I really wish the PI foundation would rein in their re-sellers for
the 1st few months after a release and limit sales to one per
customer…”
Oh, the irony! Have you any idea just how much stick we’ve
taken over the last couple of years for applying a limit of one
per customer to sales of the Zero…? ;)
Graham Toal
16th March 2018, 6:32 pm
But why are they still limited after 2 years? I understood it at
first when demand outstripped supply, but 2 years is more
than enough to have ramped up supply if you wanted to. At
this point it seems like zero sales are being deliberately
suppressed in order to sell the more profitable models. If
that’s the case why did you even create the zero in the first
place? I would buy dozens of zeros at retail if they were
available.
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 8:26 pm
We have multiple 100k’s in the supply chain – there should be
plenty. Our back office also check to make sure that resellers
are not trying to make a quick buck. The Pi main models are
sold in a different way to the Zero range, you might be getting
the two confused.
Remember that is + local taxes and P&P. Usually comes to
about ish in the UK
anon3458
15th March 2018, 1:39 pm
Yeah I do understand that it is not inclusive of taxes shipping.
I’ve generally paid between the - mark for previous PIs in the
past.
It is just quite annoying when all of the stand alone PIs are
gone and all that re-sellers have left in stock are PIs that are
part of some starter pack.
I really wish the practice of bundling PIs in the starter packs
would stop. Just sell the PIs stand alone, if the re-sellers
what to sell a separate starter pack sans the PI for and knock
or something off the price of the starter pack if ordered in the
same order as a PI i would be fine with that.
James Hughes
15th March 2018, 2:35 pm
Er, what? There were over 200k Pi3B+ in the supply
chain, most being sold individually. I doubt many have
made it in to bundles yet. There seem to be plenty
individual Pi3b+ available, so would be interesting to know
whereabouts in the world you are that you seem unable to
get one. Note, that the supply chain in USA was only filled
yesterday due to FCC requirements, so will take a day or
two to hit the shops.
The only Pi I have ever bought was part of a bundle….and
everyone who sells bundles also sells individually. Are you
sure you are not confusing Pi3B+ with the Pi0, which does
tend to be sold in bundles.
W. H. Heydt
19th March 2018, 2:00 am
I ordered a Pi3B+ on Tuesday afternoon for plus tax (about )
and shipping– (USPS) and got it Thursday. Where are you
ordering from that won’t do that?
Paul Lacatus
14th March 2018, 3:45 pm
What about a 64bit Raspbian OS ? I read that now is supported
ARM v8 instruction set
Gordon Hollingworth
14th March 2018, 8:25 pm
If it’s 64bit then it’s Debian not Raspbian…
TonyH
14th March 2018, 3:48 pm
Congratulations to all involved in bringing this out!!!
Looking forward to getting one into my hands.
Tom O’Brien
14th March 2018, 3:49 pm
My cat and I are anxiously awaiting our backordered RasPi3B+.
Our goal is to implement a Google Assistant function: Hey Google,
where’s the cat?
Seriously, I don’t wear a hat, but if I did, I would doff it right now to
the vast Raspberry Pi team who put this new product together. As
we say here in the Colonies, “Huzzah!”
Terje
14th March 2018, 4:00 pm
Hi,
As it is a new chip (BCM2837B0) I am wondering if the issues with
the I2C functionality are fixed regarding repeated start and clock
stretching functionality?
Cheers,
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 8:23 pm
No change AFAIK.
Anton Wösner
14th March 2018, 4:11 pm
Hello, that´s are great news.
At what time come the Raspbian 64bit version for Pi 3B/3B+?
That was promised at Pi 3B release date, 2 years ago.
regards
Anton
PS.: I wish for Pi 4, SATA, 4GB RAM, real 1GBit LAN, USB 3
Simon Long
14th March 2018, 4:27 pm
No, we’ve never promised a 64-bit version of Raspbian. We’ve
said it is something that we are looking at but we’re not in the
habit of making promises about things before we release them!
It may happen at some point, but that is *not* a promise…
Joshua
14th March 2018, 5:37 pm
Hmmm…perhaps no explicit ‘promise’, but when Raspbian is
the official distro and then the subsequent adoption of a 64-
bit processor, I would argue you have indeed made an
implicit ‘promise’ or at minimum, signalled certain intentions.
Why have Raspbian as the official distro, toss in a 64-bit
chip, then say: ‘well, OpenSUSE was really clammering for
it…but, please use 32-bit Raspbian & don’t expect 64-bit
Raspbian…that was because of OpenSUSEs endless
yammerimg; again though, don’t even think about using
OpenSUSE or any other 64-bit communist distro..’?
anon5465
14th March 2018, 6:28 pm
What’s the point? Until the PI has more than 4GB of RAM
there is ABSOLUTELY NO need for 64bit OS. 64Bit isn’t
faster because OMG 64bits.
The only reason the PI likely has a 64bit SOC is because it
is all they could obtain at the price point they were looking
for. Any 32bit only SOCs on the market are probably NOS
sitting in a warehouse somewhere. The price is probably
inflated since they are out of production and the
assumption being anyone who wanted it would be using it
for an extreme niche case. The use of an out production
SOC in the PI would quickly deplete the remaining stock
and they would then be stuck with releasing yet another
revision for whatever different 32bit SOC they could find,
or just say screw it and go to a 64bit SOC that is currently
in production.
anon5465
14th March 2018, 6:31 pm
This is probably also why the early revision Pi2 has a
32bit SOC, but the newer revision Pi2 has essentially
the same 64bit SOC that the Pi3 has. Supply ran out of
the 32bit SOCs, they are out of production so move to
the current in production SOCs which are all 64bit.
Simon Long
14th March 2018, 7:00 pm
Exactly. There is very little value in adopting a 64-bit OS
unless you actually need to access memory above the
32-bit threshold, and we don’t fit that much memory to
the Pi! 64-bit OSes tend to be larger installs than the
equivalent 32-bit versions (see Windows 32-bit vs. 64-
bit for details – the 64-bit versions of Windows take up
around 30% more hard drive space than the equivalent
32-bit versions), and SD card capacity (and download
bandwidth) is still relatively pricey, so we try to keep the
images as small as possible. We are able to access all
of the Pi’s RAM with a 32-bit OS – until such time as we
need 64-bit access, a 64-bit OS is really not a priority,
and we are certainly making no promises (“implicit” or
otherwise) as to when we might provide one.
Joshua
14th March 2018, 10:41 pm
So ASUS, Odroid, LeMaker, etc. ad nauseum, all had a
heck of a time getting 32-bit processors for the endless
run of SBCs on the market…? You notice how it’s
generally harder to find out you’re looking at a 32-bit
SBC than a 64-bit? Everyone who has a 64-bit chip, it’s
front and center – if not part of the name of the SBC
itself… The Raspberry Pi 3B is just as guilty as the rest
– if you’re ringing the 64-bit dinner bell, by the time I get
to my plate, I’m expecting some 64-bit meat on my plate
lest the plate is smashed onto the wall. “‘Implicitly'”
indeed; implicitly, there has been a promise of Raspbian
64-bit.
Look at it like this: why did OpenSUSE get a 64-bit OS
ready for the Pi – perhaps there are situations where a
single Pi has no need for 64-bit due to limited RAM, but
more than one Pi has been sold, maybe people own
more than one, and maybe they utilize them in a context
that requires 64-bit. Since Raspbian should be the de
facto OS, adapted to the hardware best, when I need a
64-bit OS, I don’t go to OpenSUSEs website first –
usually the company that produced the device is the 1st
stop.
I’m perfectly fine using other distros, but unless you can
say 100% of the time, there will never be a need for a
64-bit OS on the RPi3B, then you’ve also said ‘if you
need a 64-bit OS, don’t purchase our board.’ So this line
of reasoning is not to the Pi’s benefit – if it is such a
horrendous idea, can we assume there will then
absolutely never be a 64-bit version of Raspbian that
will operate on the RPi So, then either implicit or explicit
never; right now, it is explicitly never ever – we just
scored a deal on 64-bit chips, advertised the point
everywhere, but just a deal nonetheless…..
‘Oh, don’t forget to buy our product! It works! …No
Questions please, cash only…no real names…..You!
Ugly person! Leave! No Pi for you.’
Simon Long
14th March 2018, 10:55 pm
“implicitly, there has been a promise of Raspbian 64-
bit.”
Sigh.
No, there hasn’t. There has been no “promise” of any
such thing anywhere other than in your own fertile
imagination. We are keeping an eye on the requirement
for and availability of a 64-bit OS, but as yet, there is no
compelling common use case which requires it.
However, there *is* a compelling use case for not
providing a 64-bit OS – it won’t run at all on Pi 1 or Pi
Zero. The Raspbian image we ship works on all models
of the Pi – this is by design, and is something we see as
being hugely desirable. If we were to release a 64-bit
image, we would have to do so alongside a 32-bit
image. We then start to fragment the software platform;
we have to build, test and support multiple images; we
double the workload for every software release we
make, and we have to field the inevitable support
requests from beginners who have tried to run the 64-bit
image on their Pi Zero and don’t understand why it
doesn’t boot. At present, we do not see sufficient upside
from a 64-bit OS to justify the pain.
So no, for the last time, we have never “promised” a 64-
bit version of Raspbian, and we are not about to do so.
As Gordon pointed out on here earlier, we’ve yet to be
presented with a compelling case for providing one that
is any stronger than “64 is bigger than 32, so it must be
better…”
Joshua
14th March 2018, 11:50 pm
“[W]e have to field the inevitable support requests from
beginners who have tried to run the 64-bit image on
their Pi Zero and don’t understand why it doesn’t boot.
At present, we do not see sufficient upside from a 64-bit
OS to justify the pain.”
Got it!
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OS to justify the pain.”
Wait…the RPi is a learning platform for beginners…and
THEY would be a ‘pain’?!
*Double sigh (lol)
Certainly, I can decontextualize arguments as well –
you’ve quite the spin, I’ll admit that. And you do have
tact even when pushed – something that at least one
angry individual answering questions on here does not.
Anyway, I can push implicit promise all day long; you just
want ‘promise’ gone altogether – I will concede; I’m not
out to spoil your day, nor knock down the Raspberry Pi
3B(+).
Truth be told, I’ve never even used Raspbian, even on
my very first RPi I purchased. I went straight for Kali
Linux because I heard you could put it on the Pi3B and I
used Backtrack quite a bit back in the day. So I really
have no ground to stand on speaking with regard to
Raspbian.
But this is consumerism and I think direct challenges to
those creating & selling a product benefit both the
organization and the consumer – so I take the comment
on my imagination as a compliment & I say Thank You!
Eric Olson
15th March 2018, 5:30 am
Congratulations to the engineering team and everyone
else at the Raspberry Pi Foundation! It is fantastic that a
product in this price range reflects ideals of
standardisation, compatibility and reliability that are
usually seen only in high-end systems.
There are a number of people who express concern that
Raspbian uses a 32-bit kernel and userland whereas
other distributions for the Pi provide 64-bit options. As
far as I know, not only is Raspbian 32 bit, but the
userland further targets ARMv6 processors. One losses
64-bit integers when moving from 64-bit ARMv8 code to
32-bit ARMv7. One further losses NEON short vectors
when moving from ARMv7 to ARMv6. From a
performance point of view, either loss could be more
than four fold or almost nothing depending on the
application.
Having a well maintained operating system called
Raspbian that runs without change on all models is
important and one of the distinguishing features of the
Raspberry Pi. Thank you for preserving my investment
in time and money by keeping things compatible.
J Osborne
6th June 2018, 12:30 am
“Until the PI has more than 4GB of RAM there is
ABSOLUTELY NO need for 64bit OS. 64Bit isn’t faster
because OMG 64bits.”
Sometimes yes, sometimes no. On some CPUs you
need to be in 64bit mode in order to use all 64 data bits
in the integer register file. Building 1024b or larger
multiples out of 32b*32b -> 64b multiply is definitely
faster then 16b*16b -> 32b. That is a big win even with
a “limited” 1G address space. Likewise one population
count on a 64b register is faster then 2 population
counts on 32b registers plus an add.
On the x86 you also get more registers in 64bit mode,
but I don’t believe that is applicable on the ARM, nor is it
register starved like x86-32 anyway.
On other ARM systems the calling conventions were
changed when going from 32bit to 64bit, generally for
the better. If I recall ObjC’s send message got something
like 7% faster. This may be relevant to the Pi, if the
calling conventions chosen for the original Pi were
derived from generations of calling conventions all
backwards compatible with pre-Pi hardware (and this is
very possible because they used existing compilers and
existing Linux ports!).
That is a pretty small bump though, and it might not
offset the additional memory pressure of addresses
being twice as large (and integers as well if the common
short=32b, int=64b, long=64b pattern is chosen). Both
pressure on overall system RAM and on cache usage.
So more nuanced then “ABSOLUTELY NO”, but for
most uses it is firmly in the “no big deal” area…and
sometimes in the “definitely worse” zone.
Nathan
14th March 2018, 4:16 pm
Can I make a request that the power ceiling for future rPi be 2.4a
instead of 2.5a? All of my current adapters and cables are tested
for 5v 2.4a.
I’m sure a 2.4a power adapter will be fine 99% of situations, but a
vast majority of 5v USB-A power adapters don’t go above 2.4a for
USB2 connections.
anon5465
14th March 2018, 6:42 pm
My guess is the next Pi will go with a USB-C port if the power
req keeps climbing. I’m kinda surprised they didn’t do that with
this one.
Gordon Hollingworth
14th March 2018, 8:28 pm
Problem then is that everyone has to go out and buy a new
power supply… Plus USB C isn’t all that cheap at the
moment, three or four times the cost for the connector in the
1m off quantity!
David bensoussan
14th March 2018, 4:37 pm
You mention 64 bit chip, will there be a better 64 bit support?
Gordon Hollingworth
14th March 2018, 8:30 pm
We’ve said in the past that if people can show an improvement
in performance with a 64 bit OS then we’d think about it. It’s
now been two years…
Gordon
Amy
15th March 2018, 1:04 am
date -d @2147483647
date -d @2147483648
The second command performs better on 64-bit Linux. On
32-bit Linux it gives an error because it’s past the end of time.
Is the ability to use dates in/after 2038 not important? I
assume everyone creating embedded systems with 32-bit
Linux knows about this, right‽ :)
Simon Long
15th March 2018, 7:11 am
I can personally guarantee that we will have a solution for
this in place by 2038. Until then, it’s really not a major
problem…
luminous
15th March 2018, 6:27 pm
Memory mapped IO operations, mongodb, several bits
of apache software, postgresql, all benefit from larger
address sizes. More so in the case of mongodb
considering that on a pi, each node can only store 4gig
total in the database.
And its not just about that, the extra processor registers,
ability to use simd directly, rather then as a co-
processor, and removal of the odd ball conditional
instructions(aka simplified decode path) Give armv8 a
good boost.
Simon Long
15th March 2018, 6:33 pm
When you say these pieces of software “benefit”, is that
actually demonstrable in benchmarks? If so, what is the
degree of benefit they see? By what percentage do they
speed up?
This is what no-one has managed to provide – actual
evidence of the benefits of 64-bit. If people can
demonstrate a real improvement in performance in
useful applications that are used by a significant
proportion of the user base, we are happy to consider
moving to 64-bit; but thus far, we’ve not seen any
evidence that it is actually worthwhile.
David
6th April 2018, 1:48 am
You do know there are ways to build your own 64 bit
kernel with Jessie, right?
Instead of wanting everything for free handed to you, do a
little googling and actually get into the project. I built a
64bit kernel last night in under 2 hours with instructions I
found in forums, and it’s running… Yet the perplexing thing
is, other than to prove I could do it, what was the point? I
don’t have any apps that require 64 bit OS, and the
Memory doesn’t require 64 bit addressing…
Quit acting like spoiled children and do something for
yourselves…
david ben
15th March 2018, 9:36 am
In my situation, it’s not about performance but I’m using 64
bits software (only) for consumer market, we are probably
switch to a competitor because of it.
Joshua
14th March 2018, 4:40 pm
I have 2 RPi 3Bs, a Tinker Board, & a Rock64 4G… In terms of
price of RAM at some insane price point, the Rock64 isn’t
substantially more expensive than the RPi 3B+…(?). And as for
power demand, it operates with a 5v/2.5A adapter…the same as
the RPi 3B+. So is the difference of -25 really that huge of a
difference, when the Rock64 also has USB 3.0, eMMC support,
Gigabit Ethernet, a higher clock CPU speed, 4x the RAM at a
higher clock speed, superior GPU performance, BT, IR Sensor, &
endorsed by both Jesus & Moses…? Don’t get me wrong, my
RPis are great & an update is cool; but why not also build a model
that is at a price point a bit higher as well that can address some
of desires other boards do? …btw, I hate the Tinker Board; other
than pretty colors, please don’t take design cues from Asus…
Carlooser
14th March 2018, 4:47 pm
I am sorry to say that, but in Czech Republic is this not available
for but for ~
Helen Lynn
14th March 2018, 4:57 pm
A 3B+, delivered, costs the equivalent of ~ in the UK too; the
price is plus local taxes and shipping, and of course those vary
a lot according to where you are in the world, what kind of
consumer you are, and so on.
fanoush
14th March 2018, 6:31 pm
For me it was slightly cheaper to buy 3B+ and 0W at pimoroni
with shipping to CZ than it would be to buy same stuff via
rpishop cz with local shipping. And as a bonus with pimoroni I
can get another Pi Zero with each order :-) rpishop won’t sell
me another cheap Zero (ever?), they previously cancelled my
second Zero order few weeks after first one claiming I already
have one and can’t get another! So I don’t buy with them
anymore. Fortunately at Pimoroni Zero is one per order, not per
customer, so that is where my Pi 3B+ money went today (and
as already said it was even cheaper).
Davidben
14th March 2018, 4:53 pm
You mention 64 bit twice in the article. Will there be a support
improvement ? For example more kernel support or a 64 bits
raspbian.
Thanks
Nick
14th March 2018, 4:54 pm
Great addition. Only thing I wish it had was additional usb power,
also an actual power switch or easier way to recover from low-
level mode. Maybe built in bootloader too (I know not everyone
uses them, but it would be nice to have basic BIOS GUI-like
controls and bootloader options)
AndrewS
15th March 2018, 10:01 am
If you want to play with “bootloader options” take a look at
https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/configuration/config-
txt/README.md
W. H. Heydt
14th March 2018, 5:35 pm
Congrats on the “mid-life kicker”. The Pi3B+ looks to be a quite
nice upgrade. Also…excited that there is at least a possibility of a
Pi3A+, though I have to admit that the feeling is tempered by a
long–by Pi standards–string of disappointing failures to make
good on “promises” in this area, what with the cancellation of the
Pi2A and non-appearance of the Pi3A.
So… Suggestions for additional upgrades…
First, the Pi3A+. The A+ is getting pretty long in the tooth and
needs a refresh. Right now, there is comparatively little to
distinguish an A+ from a Pi0 (even though there are sound
technical differences). A Pi3A+ would, I think, provide a solid
“middle choice” where a B series Pi isn’t needed or wanted and a
‘2835 based board just won’t cut it.
Second, another refresh of the Pi2B. Call it a Pi2B+ for want of
anything better. It would reduce the number of BoM items to stock
as all ‘2837 parts would be the B0 stepping. It could probably
allow boosting the default clock of the Pi2B to 1GHz or 1.1GHz.
Switching to the LAN9515 would give the same boost to Ethernet
speed (and, I dare say, that would be done without changing from
Pi2B to Pi2B+).
Third, it’d be nice to see CM3+ and CM3L+ modules available. I
don’t expect those to appear any time soon, though. Indeed, I think
the Pi3A+ deserves earlier release.
Now for a question… While it is definitively stated that the
‘2837B0 will have PxE booting enabled by default, I didn’t see
anything about USB MSD booting being enabled as well. Is that
OTP bit set, too? (Or are the features enabled internally without
the need to set OTP bits? E.g. Don’t test the bits, just act as if
they’re set?)
Gordon Hollingworth
14th March 2018, 8:34 pm
Ethernet and MSD booting are part of the same thing, so both
are now enabled by default (it will still boot from SD card first
though if you have one plugged in)
Gordon
W. H. Heydt
15th March 2018, 12:21 am
Thank you! I admit that I had assumed the “normal” boot
sequencing as given in the documentation would still be in
place.
My first Pi3B+ will be swapped in in place of a Pi3B
connected (and booting from) a Pi3B. From this data, I am
assuming that (following an update/upgrade cycle) should
Just Work.
Pihome
14th March 2018, 5:50 pm
Congratulations from the PiHome, can’t wait to get my hands on to
one of these, Thanks you for hard work.
Pihome
Rune Andresen
14th March 2018, 5:57 pm
I would have expected the LAN bandwidth to be more like:
3.1415 (10^2Mb/s)
;-)
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:15 pm
:)
Shad Wiklins
14th March 2018, 6:01 pm
Still waiting for the V4-B+ :)
Anton
14th March 2018, 6:02 pm
Congratulations to the release!
Please, one question. I understand you don’t want to talk about
future products but maybe you could say that you are not
considering this at all: do you have any plans for a camera board
with larger sensor? Say FourThirds larger?
Thank you!
W. H. Heydt
14th March 2018, 8:25 pm
That would be very expensive and Pis are all about being
INexpensive.
Anton
14th March 2018, 9:10 pm
Sure but perhaps there could more than one model, like there
is Zero and B.
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:17 pm
We’re certainly aware of the market for a higher-end
camera module.
Alan Pullen
14th March 2018, 6:21 pm
Will the POE hat have fixed headers in place for the POE pins or
will it allow stackable headers? I.e. will it be possible to connect an
additional transformer to the pins to allow a different voltage say
12v to be used for IR lamps?
Tuxedoar
14th March 2018, 6:24 pm
Ha, ha. A few days ago, I asked Eben how the hardware on RPi’s
would evolve in the future!. I even wondered about the possibility
of having a Gigabit update for the wired interface!. He kindly
answered that, most probably, we would have that… and here it
is!!. I didn´t suspect that an actual update on the RPi3 was this
close!. Great surprise!!.
Congrats and thanks!.
Cheers.
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:18 pm
I did enjoy replying to your comment the other day :)
Peter
14th March 2018, 6:24 pm
Please, please, make a faster Pi Zero.
Peter
14th March 2018, 6:25 pm
Oh, and please also consider a V2 cam with different angle lens
options.
W. H. Heydt
14th March 2018, 8:28 pm
I’ll second this, but in my own way. I would suggest a camera
board with a lens mount. That way, people could obtain their
own lenses with whatever specs they want without burdening
the RPT with sourcing and providing even a small subset of the
rather large range of possibilities.
My own preference would be for a C-mount, but CS-mount
would be more likely.
Craig Van Degrift
15th March 2018, 3:15 am
I am making a digital microscope and bought an M12 mount
from http://www.m12lenses.com/Board-Lenses-s/12.htm .
The one I bought needed a bit of modification for the Pi
Camera, but I now see that they also sell mounts specifically
for Pi Camera V1 and V2. I will soon buy those along with
more M12 lenses and M12 extenders. It is very nice to use
M12 lenses in the Pi Camera!
TonyH
14th March 2018, 7:11 pm
Next to the RUN hole is now a hole labeled PEN. Before, there
used to be a ground connector there. How is the PEN connection
different?
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:19 pm
PEN gives you the ability to disable the MaxLinear PMIC,
completely powering down the board. More on this in due
course.
TonyH
15th March 2018, 4:19 pm
Can the PEN and Run connections still be used for a reset
button, or will we now have to tie into a different ground pin
(from somewhere) to implement a reset button? (I’ve been
soldering on a header for a reset button as a standard first
step ever since I got my first Pi years ago.)
jdb
15th March 2018, 6:30 pm
PEN and RUN are signal inputs that are independent of
each other.
Ground should be used from any of the GND pins on the
GPIO connector.
AndrewS
15th March 2018, 8:18 pm
That’s a (slight) shame – it means simple solutions like
http://raspi.tv/2012/making-a-reset-switch-for-your-rev-
2-raspberry-pi won’t work any more.
TonyH
16th March 2018, 1:14 pm
Many HATs totally obscure the GPIO pins. Implementing
a reset switch will now require using some sort of shim
board to break out a ground pin, soldering onto the
GPIO header and hoping that pushing down the HAT
doesn’t mess up the solder joint, or buying something
like Pimoroni’s onoff shim. It also means that a simple 2-
pin female header can’t be used for the switch. I, for
one, will miss having that ground hole there. I would
have liked to have seen the PEN control added as
another hole and the ground hole left alone. Oh well. I
still look forward to the other improvements.
Niels
14th March 2018, 7:16 pm
If I knew this I would’ve waited, I bought the 3B last sunday.
Anyway, bright side would be an extra Pi for another project.
Mike
14th March 2018, 7:35 pm
I have been watching Microcenter all day and… nothing :|
ukscone
14th March 2018, 8:37 pm
I asked on twitter and they said by middle of next week but
possibly sooner if the planets align correctly
PieGuy
14th March 2018, 7:44 pm
Nice refinement but too bad it’s still only 1GB DRAM. Only retro
gaming use case will see some benefit but not for much else.
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 8:22 pm
Only retro gaming? Are you sure? We sell 5M devices a year
with 1GB RAM. That seems slightly higher than the retro
gaming market.
W. H. Heydt
14th March 2018, 8:31 pm
So long as the existing VC4 is in use, no Pi will have more than
1GB. And the VC4 isn’t going to change until a whole new SoC
is developed.
So…I don’t expect any substantial changes beyond these
tweaks before the Pi4B shows up.
I do kind of wonder of the LAN9515 is USB 3, at least on the
upstream side…or if a fully USB 3 version exists or is in
development…
AndrewS
15th March 2018, 8:22 pm
https://www.microchip.com/wwwproducts/ProductCompare/L
AN7515/LAN9514 says the LAN7515 is USB2.0 only.
From Eben’s comments in the article, it sounds like it might
have been specifically designed for the Pi 3B+ ?
Peter Ryan
14th March 2018, 8:08 pm
Not important but, there appears to be less screen-printing on the
3B+ board than previous boards. Why?
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:20 pm
It looks nicer, and we found that we didn’t use the component
labels ourselves.
Ken
15th March 2018, 8:39 am
When I broke off L2 by using pliers to undo the mounting nut
the legends allowed me to identify the component and
replace it. Hopefully there will be a diagram available
showing the components identifiers. Glad to see 3B+ has
more space next to the mounting hole adjacent to the micro
USB
luminous
14th March 2018, 8:46 pm
Ram is to expensive, so rather then requesting more, how about
faster/lower power memory instead?, 1Gig of LPDDR4 would both
be faster and a way to lower the power footprint, even more so if
you could run it at a lower clock rate and only increase the peak
bandwidth a little bit.
James Hughes
14th March 2018, 10:06 pm
Unfortunately, the controller on the SoC doesn’t support
LPDDR4
John Beale
14th March 2018, 8:54 pm
Great news to read. Pi keeps getting better! My current
application involving live video analytics can use every last bit of
additional CPU performance available, and 1 GB is still OK for
now. In the future, will be happy to put any amount of added
memory to use with deep learning image-recognition networks.
Obligatory nitpick: I notice the POE connector pinout seems to be
exactly square. does that mean a flying-lead power connector can
be attached 4 rotational positions (3 wrong ways and 1 right way)?
Or I guess, intended only for a daughterboard which only fits one
way?
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:21 pm
As you say, the primary goal was to support a daughterboard,
where the GPIO connector constrains the orientation.
Michael
14th March 2018, 9:31 pm
Nice to see! But I agree to the people who want more ram, we
definately could need more of it…2gb or even more. Just watch
out how browsers – or Mathematica for example – eat up the 1gb
for breakfast…more ram for next Pi please.
Btw, does the new thermal throttle affect the old Pi 3b, too anyhow
above 70 degree? If so, how to disable? Cause I already have a
thermal controlled fan on my ‘old’ 3b.
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:22 pm
We haven’t changed the clocking or voltage rules for any older
products.
anon2454
14th March 2018, 11:59 pm
I would say if you already have a working thermal solution on
your PI it shouldn’t matter if the new thermal profiles are on your
older PI. If your thermal solution is working it shouldn’t get that
hot to trigger the thermal profile. If your cooling solution fails,
then the thermal profiles might save your butt from having to
buy a new PI
Michael
16th March 2018, 12:52 pm
My solution works fine – but ‘kicks in’ at 75 degree, not at 70
already, thats why I asked.
But solved as it seems to work as before. Greets, M.
Niall Saunders
15th March 2018, 9:12 pm
Don’t concern yourself about how Mathematica eats up RAM –
not until you have fully understood that the RPi implementation
of Mathematica is purely a ‘taster’ version of the full package.
I already made that mistake, trying to use Mathematica ‘on the
cheap’ to perform a highly-detailed optical analysis of a pro-
sumer astronomical telescope. Mathematica, on the Pi, simply is
not up to that kind of challenge. It is quite buggy, tends to crash
with alarming regularity, and (irrespective of how much RAM
you make available to it) it has been released as a version that
will not run on anything other than a single-core.
Sure, there are workarouds, I started by breaking the overal
task into several thousands of much smaller tasks, and then
collating all the data at the output of one stage to be used as
input data for the next. But, this in itself was a tedious task, and
very prone to user-error. A far better choice would have been to
run Mathematica on the 12 cores and 128Gb of RAM of my
3.6GHz PC.
But, then again, I am a Scotsman, and I wasn’t prepared to pay
the asking price for a piece of software that I was only ever
going to use once !!!
So, before someone else jumps on this tired old ‘RAM’ soapbox,
and starts to complain or wish for ‘more RAM and a 64-bit OS’
perhaps they ought to take the time to at least read ALL the
comments that have already been made on these issues.
You don’t need a 64-bit OS, because you don’t have enough
RAM in your RPi in the first place, and you are not going to get
any more RAM at the current price bracket.
If you absolutely cannot live without more RAM (and the
subsequent requirement for a 64-bit OS) then a Rasperry Pi
solution is just not for you.
Michael
16th March 2018, 1:15 pm
No doubt that Mathematica runs much smoother on a ‘high-
end’ pc…but it is fine on my Pi, too. Enough to learn how it
works and enough to do some cool animations for example.
Furthermore it should be the same as the “normal” version
and definately using 4 cores, at least here for me. Without a
problem. The only problem is the actual 11.2-version which
only detects 1 core atm, its a bug (and already reported and
being fixed in the next update) – but it could be solved easily
by modifying the config file (just have a look at Wolfram-
communiy for a how-to).
For sure it runs not as smooth and fast as a ‘normal’ pc – but
we definately could do more with it with more ram. Same as
for the browsers, just watch out how much the new Firefox
57/58/59 eat on a normal pc…if we ever want a normal
Firefox again on our Pi, we definately need more ram in my
opinion. Just for being ‘forearmed for the future’ at all / going
with the time a bit. Sure, 1gb is “enough” – but more is
better/offering more possibilities :) Years ago Bill Gates said
“8 bit are enough”…but for what exactly?
timonske
14th March 2018, 9:45 pm
Will the PoE board be open source as a sort of reference
implementation of PoE for the Pi? Similar to the CM IO Board.
Eben Upton — post author
14th March 2018, 10:23 pm
That’s a good thought. We’ll certainly consider it.
M-H
17th March 2018, 4:01 pm
Yes please be as open as possible on the hardware,
connections, and possibilities. As many of us might not be in
schools daily, but are still learning by tinkering. Somehow still
part of your target group?
I have the urge to build a HAT that contains both a POE
power receiver and DAC and amp.
Thank you for cramming more and more features into the 35
dollar wonder.
Neil
15th March 2018, 9:36 am
Check out the datasheets and application notes for the Linear
Tech LTC4267 – plenty of useful circuits in the applications
section. It would be helpful to know if the ethernet jack has the
diodes built-in or not (I’m guessing not because of the four pins
– a quick check with a DMM would verify that).
timonske
18th March 2018, 6:41 pm
These are exactly the kind of questions that would be easily
answered with the PoE board getting open sourced :)
Also things like input protection and filtering can be good to
know and of course vary between hardware. So a generic
reference implementation of some PoE hardware is only
partially helpful.
Maetes
14th March 2018, 10:35 pm
I so totally would love a Pi for a price of 80 to 100 Euro. Enough
money to deal with a better Soc, 2 to 4 GM Ram, a 2nd HDMI and
USB 3.0.
With a Pi like this you could replace about 90 % of all PCs in the
World (my estimation). At least all PCs of all my older Family-
Members. And the most PCs in gouvernments, most of the time
big, energy-wasting machines dealing with one self-written, ugly
programm.
Replace them with an 3 or 3+?
No way, not possible, to much isnt running properly.
To often “sorry man, this app isnt running, pi to slow or not enough
Ram”.
No, I dont want to by a Mini-PC, because better Hardware isnt the
only important thing. Its the software and the people behind it,
what makes the pi different.
The 3+ unfortunately is another to tiny step, last great leap was
the Pi-2.
And thats really … really long ago :)
Greetings,
Ma
Darth.Severus
16th March 2018, 2:16 am
> To often “sorry man, this app isnt running, pi to slow or not
enough Ram”.
For general desktop computer use it seems to be enought. I’m
using Raspi3 as desktop, it runs Chromium with a lot of tabs
open and also a shell with a lot of tabs open. I don’t think every
computer really needs more. Working on grafical or video stuff
is another ballpark, of course.
However, I’m using additional 1.2GB swapspace on a external
disc (no ssd), you might wanna lock into that.
Noxmiles
14th March 2018, 10:35 pm
So, this will probably be the last with the VideoCore IV (except,
there’s a B++).
When the Raspberry Pi 4 will be born it will be 2019 or 2020. So,
after about 8 years the time has come, that the limitations of the
VideoCore IV are finally reached.
So, what are the limitations of the VideoCore IV:
Max. 1GB RAM
Max USB 2.0 – therefore no real Gigabit Ethernet
Max 1080p and no VP9/h.265 native
…
Yes, it is great, that there is a FOSS driver. It’s the central unit of
the Raspberry Pi and very important for the compatibility. But it’s
from ~2010 and that’s reeeeaaaaaly old.
Probably that will be a break without backward compatiblity. But it
has to be done. For the 64 bit. For the 2GB RAM. For HiDPI
Screens. For the next 10 years.
ZhangYing
14th March 2018, 11:21 pm
I wished that pi has a USB signals with pin-head for easily connect
to our HAT board!thanks!
Garry
15th March 2018, 12:27 am
Top marks guys!
My very first Raspberry Pi which was ordered on launch day is still
working as I type, running my MQTT and Node-RED, embedded
in my home security system.
Right now I am typing this out on a Pi Model 3 stuck to the back of
my TV with Velcro but as old habits die hard, it would have been
rude not to order a model 3 B+ from Farnell today. Time to
upgrade the back of the TV!
Thanks to the Pi team
Eben Upton — post author
17th March 2018, 5:28 pm
I spend a lot of time looking behind TVs these days. Amazing
how often you find a Raspberry Pi there. A favourite was
walking into the CNN operations room in London and finding
several TVs on the wall showing the Raspbian desktop.
Gerry Stilton
15th March 2018, 1:04 am
Folks,
It’s 2018, we can’t be living in a 512MB world. It’s painfully
insufficient to do anything. Minimum 1GB, optionally to 4GB.
I was so excited and was ready to order until I can across the
posting, that reads:
https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/introducing-raspberry-pi-model-b-
plus/
“It runs the same software, and still has 512MB RAM;”
is great but 55 or even 65 if only for some more RAM please!!!
Gerry Stilton
15th March 2018, 1:25 am
Folks,
Not to throw cold water on anyone, because I am a proud
owner of a raspberry pi I model B. But even Rock64 sports
STANDARD 2GB of RAM of its board:
https://www.pine64.org/?product=rock64-media-board-computer
for USD and for a 4GB, it costs USD. Something is wrong here.
How is their base model with 2GB cost less than a Pi 3 model
B+, granted it lacks build-in wifi and Bluetooth. I can add that for
USD, but I can’t add more RAM:
https://www.amazon.com/Wireless-Bluetooth-Transmitter-
Receiver-
External/dp/B01JYE5BT2/ref=pd_sbs_23__encoding=UTF8&p
d_rd_i=B01JYE5BT2&pd_rd_r=CNP3ZH1BRVMG589HFT82&
pd_rd_w=0e16X&pd_rd_wg=HfCpZ&psc=1&refRID=CNP3ZH1
BRVMG589HFT82
But theirs is a 1.6GHz quad core. 512MB just ain’t enough.
Unfortunately, I think this needs to go back to the drawing board
for way more RAM.
Simon Long
15th March 2018, 7:16 am
The Pi 3+, like the Pi 3 and the Pi 2 before it, has 1GB of
RAM, not the 512MB you are quoting.
Gerry Stilton
15th March 2018, 1:34 am
Even for non-profit such as Raspberry Pi, you have no excuse
for building an inferior/non-competitive product compare to
Rock64. DOA. Already time for model B+ ver 2.0
Come on, make it a success and I am ready to order a few for
my robotic club kids.
Simon Long
15th March 2018, 7:33 am
“Come on, make it a success…”
You do realise we’ve sold nearly 20 million Pis over the last 4
years? Do you not think that might already count as a
“success” to most people?
Rok
15th March 2018, 8:12 am
RPI is like a mac, when sd with raspbian is inserted, it will
work. You will get updates (even for firmware). Community
will solve you issues. Drivers will work out of the box.
With any other board you are basically buying some
HARDWARE chips which “maybe” work together. I dont need
hardware, i need a working platform. I am personally sick of
thiw wanabe computers, which cause only problems, but they
run on 74764Ghz. My last experience is with some android
box, loaded with the latest and the greatest hardware. It is
crashing, manufacturer does not provide any supprt, there
are no updates for almost a year, there are some strange
crashing errors of certain apps which i have never seen on
android, etc., etc., etc. In one word bunch of problems.
Hope you get the point, that working solution need much
more than just hardware.
AndrewS
15th March 2018, 8:25 pm
Yeah, I think the software support and stability is
something that a lot of people overlook. I think it’s part of
the reason why the RPi community has grown so large :)
James Hughes
15th March 2018, 9:57 am
Why does a robot controller need more than 1GB of RAM?
Seems rather excessive to be demanding more memory for
something that clearly doesn’t need it
Asking for a friend. Got it!
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Roger “Merch” Merchberger
15th March 2018, 5:22 pm
Just a thought…
Maybe his “Robot Controller” is SkyNet? :-)
I could see that needing a bit more memory than a
standard Pi…
Michael
16th March 2018, 1:32 pm
The rason is that “some” guys using it as a desktop-
replacement, for playing games, for browsing and all that
other interesting stuff…and not as a controller only.
If you really need a simple controller just buy an older Pi 1
or a Pi Zero for example…but a new Raspberry with more
ram or the possibility to expand the ram by the user itself
just could extend the portfoilo in an awesome way.
Darth.Severus
16th March 2018, 2:59 am
> Come on, make it a success and I am ready to order a few
for my robotic club kids.
You might still have a great epiphany before you, or maybe
even two: Thanks to scifi tvshows and movies many of us
think robots need to have their main computer in their body.
But wait, scifi is not reality, they write it so that it is most
entertaining.
If your robots need more processing power, then make them
connect to some bigger computer. This is actually very
fascinating, because limits like power consumption for the
computing in their bodies will not be so relevant any more.
Oh, and they can have some kind of hive mind, like the Borg.
AndrewS
16th March 2018, 3:10 pm
I guess in a way that’s already how robots using Google or
Alexa voice control services work ;)
(with the “extra processing power” simply being accessed
over the internet)
Simon Long
15th March 2018, 7:15 am
Errr – all Pi 2s and 3s have 1GB of RAM. The posting you
quote is the launch announcement for a Pi from 2014, i.e. 4
years ago.
bensimmo
15th March 2018, 9:01 am
How do you manage to get to the original B+ (Pi1), when all the
info you need is in the blog you are posting too.
-There has been a 2B, 3B and now 3B+ in the B range since
then, ALL 1GB of RAM, more would be nice but it’s not going to
stop the majority of people buying it. If I wanted something
more, I’d just buy a second hand laptop.
That B+ has ‘shrank’ into the ZeroW replacing the Ethernet with
WiFi for a lot less.
Fozz
15th March 2018, 2:18 am
I see nothing but fiddling with the product because they don’t have
a Pi4 to be able to release… No big advantages here at all. No
real increase in speeds, because it’s really the same chip with
throttling bolted on. Big Fat Hairy Deal!! No increase in memory
because the dated video core IV won’t allow it, hence no
advantage to using the processor in 64bit mode, hence no 64bit
OS. Yet they’re still trumpeting that it has a 64bit processor!! No
point except that it’s marketing BS. Along with the usual BS about
the US Dollar price, that nobody anywhere can actually buy it for.
We need 4Gigs RAM. Hell fire, I mean how much has Ram fallen
in price over the last 5 years!…. Ditch the crappy video core IV for
something with significantly less restriction. A Processor running at
a genuine 1.8 to 2Ghz if you’re sticking to 32Bit. Not this pointless
smoke and mirrors trick with throttling.. those would be an actual
real improvement. All I can see in this release is marketing hype.
Nothing changes here does it….
James Hughes
15th March 2018, 9:53 am
You are correct, we don’t have the Pi4 for release. That is some
time away. This is simply a point release to make the current
model a bit better, at no additional cost over the last version.
We have a roadmap, and it’s going pretty well. We know what
needs to be done over time, but a Pi4 is a long term project, you
don’t get much changes out of three years from start to finish, if
you are going to do it properly. ie, works well, robust, certified
with a solid software base.
RAM prices, which clearly you haven’t been following, are going
up.
As for marketing hype, well, you are entitled to an opinion,
wrong though it may be. This is a clear improvement over the
previous model in a number of ways – wireless, ethernet, but
especially thermal management. And it’s the same price, so
clearly you are getting more for your money.
Of course, not everyone will be affected by the improvements.
And if you’re happy with a competitor product that does all the
things you are requesting (is there one?), then get that until the
Pi4 comes out.
Just out of interest, why do you need 4G of RAM? What use
case ACTUALLY requires that amount of RAM, or are you just
using very badly written software and need to compensate for
that by throwing memory at it? When I was a lad, I had a 32K
device where 20K went on the video memory. It taught me to be
efficient when writing code. The original 640K PC was amazing,
so much memory, but the lessons learnt remain – write decent
code and reduce memory footprint
Niall Saunders
15th March 2018, 9:31 pm
@ James:
“32K RAM – with 20K dediated to (mono) video – teaches
you how to code efficiently”
Hear, hear – I second that.
I’m glad I am retired, and I am glad that I never had to deal
with ‘programmers’ directly – the vast majority don’t have a
clue about efficient coding, not even the fact that good
coding eliminates bugs at the outset.
I would probably have had to employ an assistant just to
hand-write their names on their dismissal letters, just to keep
up with how fast I would have been wanting to get rid of
them!!
Coding is a skill – fortunately easy to acquire on the RPi
platform(s) – and, just like driving a car, if you don’t take the
time to learn it properly, you will eventually ‘crash and burn’.
However, do you really need a Lamborghini in order to
improve your driving skills? (Apparently ‘yes’, as most Audi
drivers are only ever too happy to demonstrate!!!)
J Osborne
6th June 2018, 1:55 am
“When I was a lad, I had a 32K device where 20K went on
the video memory.”
Wow, what machine was that? My 8-bit era machines had
way way less dedicated to video memory (8K out of 64K
maybe?)
“And if you’re happy with a competitor product that does all
the things you are requesting (is there one?), then get that
until the Pi4 comes out.”
So I can take that as confirmation that the Pi4 will have
everything I dream of to replace my ZFS file server? (more
RAM, and SATA or something similar). ;-)
(honestly that is my only household project or server type
system the Pi is currently unable to handle…and as I have
that covered I’m not exactly going to hold my breath until the
required specs fall into a price umbrella…let alone until ya’ll
decide that is the right set of things to spend the budget on! I
mean I want fast external multidisk I/O, but I would expect
ADC and DACs would be more useful to most Pi owners!)
cthulhu
15th March 2018, 3:51 am
Good lord! I blinked and you guys put out the Zero W and now a
3B+, each more impressive than the last! Do you even sleep?
Skylarking
15th March 2018, 5:09 am
Currently CEC can’t be used to power up the RPi however i did
notice a mod can be used to provide such a feature. For details of
the mod, see https://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?
tid=174315&pid=2651811#pid2651811
So the question is, does the RPi-3B+ provide pins or solder pads
for accessing the CEC wire alowing for simpler mod or better yet,
is such a CEC power up feature included in the design
(accessable via jumper or such?
Skylarking
15th March 2018, 5:15 am
I had the AP2553W6-7 Load Switch IC fail on my RPi-3B some 13
months after purchase. I them replaced it with my old RPi-2 using
the official PRI-3 2.5A power plug, however it died about a year
later.
I know failures happen but is the RPi-3B+ built with a little more
robustness as compared to earlier modles or is the RPi family
considered a cheap short lived throw away item?
Great device by the way :)
James Hughes
15th March 2018, 9:39 am
They all go through the same testing procedure, there should
be no reduction in robustness over the various models. We
certainly don’t consider it throwaway, although we do consider it
cheap to buy!
Leo
15th March 2018, 6:01 am
Good news.
Does GPU have any improvement for supporting DirectX?
Microsoft said the GPU of Raspberry Pi 3 doesn’t have enough
capacity for supporting Directx.
Carlos
15th March 2018, 6:57 am
I love PI but I need more memory…
(._.)
Darth.Severus
16th March 2018, 2:40 am
What for? You might need better software. Maybe also to
increase your swap file.
Rok
15th March 2018, 7:52 am
I would totaly buy a PI costing 50% more, if it would include:
-at least 2GB memory
-some better cpu (test: smooth browsing, playing 1080p youtube,
watching tv stream in browser)
-USB3.0, better IO connectivitiy (test: download a large torrent
with 10MB/s speed), current situation is as follows: downloading
to SD cart freezes the RPI – IO chip just can not handle it,
downloading to external drive will give you ~2 or 3 MB/s. Torrent
speeds are more or less the same regardless of the RPI version.
-sata (NATIVE – or as close as it gets to native! not with some
junky usb-to-sata bridge) would be large plus.
Christian Nobel
15th March 2018, 9:23 am
You are barking up the wrong tree.
The Pi is perfectly capable of playing 1080p – I am using it for
digital signage, and it works flawless.
And, without sounding like Bill, 1G is totally enough for the time
beeing – write some decent software!
And streaming is no problem, at home I use a Pi for OSMC, and
it works perfectly (the problems I face has something to do with
the Danish broadcaster, not the Pi).
So if you want a PC, buy a PC.
James Hughes
15th March 2018, 9:36 am
We don’t have a model like that I am afraid.
Erik Tamminga
15th March 2018, 8:31 am
Hi,
Does this iteration of Pi-3B+ introduce any changes to the way the
Serial UARTS work? The GPIO uart vs the Bluetooth uart.
Hardware vs Software.
Regards,
Erik
James Hughes
15th March 2018, 9:34 am
That’s more of a Device tree issue rather than HW (which
hasn’t changed in this iteration). See
https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/configuration/uart.m
d
Erik Tamminga
15th March 2018, 1:08 pm
I was hoping a new SoC and the BT update would give us a
second HW Uart so we wouldn’t have to fiddle anymore with
CPU clocks, overlays, etc.
Maybe next release? ;)
James Hughes
15th March 2018, 2:36 pm
Pi3B+ does NOT use a new SoC, it’s the same bcm2837. I
think the BT part of the wireless chip is the same as well.
Christian Nobel
15th March 2018, 9:18 am
As I can understand the max speed for the Ethernet is approx
300Mbps.
These 300Mbps are shared for the USB bus, so is it possible (if
not network load else) to obtain at similar speed at a USB port as
USB2 more or less has the same effective speed?
Next, is it possible to let the bootloader point to the USB port
instead of the SD card, thereby only using a USB2 disk?
This could make a perfect mini server.
James Hughes
15th March 2018, 9:35 am
See
bootmodes…https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/hardw
are/raspberrypi/bootmodes/README.md
W. H. Heydt
19th March 2018, 3:16 am
My tests of USB mass storage devices give speeds around
35mB/s, which is a pretty good approximation of 300Mn/s, so,
yes, you can see the same speed. (Don’t confuse bits per
second with bytes per second.)
KyRol
15th March 2018, 10:53 am
I still awaiting RPi3 with 2GB of RAM at least. I may pay more, but
still need it. Because of RAM amount I had to pick competitive
SBC and I’m not happy about it until now. Please, please release
2GB revision. Also there is worth to consider another variations of
units – 4GB or even 8GB of RAM. By releasing RPi with such
huge amount of memory, many complex and resource hungry
projects will become possible. Also operation on RAM is better
than on the storage because numerous reasons. If software
improvements will go by this way then many applications will
become even more reliable. Please, please – think about that, do
not refuse my words.
James Hughes
15th March 2018, 10:59 am
Google would have found the answer to this, or even just
reading the comments here, but to explain it one last time…..
The SoC on the Pi3 (and previous models) is limited to 1GB of
RAM by the HW itself. To modify the silicon to support more
than 1GB is a VERY expensive and time consuming task. It’s
also something that would need to be done by Broadcom, the
chip supplier, not the RPF. It’s time, in my opinion, that is better
spent on the next major model release, the Pi4.
Peter
15th March 2018, 12:55 pm
I know these aren’t cutting edge questions but ..
1. Any improvement to the analog audio out?
2. Are the media Codecs still a thing? I thought something opened
up on the mpeg side of things recently?
thx!
James Hughes
15th March 2018, 2:36 pm
1. Not that I am aware of.
2. Yes, patents are not yet free worldwide so we will retain the
current system.
jdb
15th March 2018, 6:14 pm
Per. 1: the sigma-delta noise shaping scheme is now enabled
by default in this release of Raspbian. Analogue audio now
approaches 16-bit (CD-quality).
More information here:
https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=195178
Peter
15th March 2018, 8:09 pm
Nice !!!!
lolo
16th March 2018, 10:08 am
Is this modification applied also on previous models, by
upgrading Raspbian ?
It can be useful to drive power mosfets direcly from a Pi 0/0W
GPIO’s to make a very cheap FDA with a good audio quality !
Thanks again to the fundation ;)
Marc
15th March 2018, 1:44 pm
Congrats for this new version! Has it been any change on the
analog audio output?
Herbaldew
15th March 2018, 2:31 pm
Regarding from changelog “WiFi is disabled until wireless
regulatory domain is set (Pi 3 B+ only)…..”
Does this mean that when I boot the first time that wifi will be
enabled automatically if I have my proper wpa_supplicant.conf in
the boot folder? or….
Does this mean I will have to be hardwired or connect with monitor
and kb for initial wifi setup?
Thanks
Serge Schneider
15th March 2018, 4:04 pm
How did you previously configure wifi without attaching a
keyboard and mouse? The same approach should continue to
work (just make sure your wpa_supplicant.conf has country=
set).
Petr Hajek
15th March 2018, 2:54 pm
Guys, is R3 or R3+ enough for Libre Office with autocorrect and
some pictures?
luminous
15th March 2018, 5:57 pm
How about pi3b+ model with the mini csi/dsi connectors like on pi
zero, would be nice if pi could move towards universal cable
compatibility.
Phil
15th March 2018, 6:27 pm
This is awesome! Still no built-in eMMC, though :-(
Michel
15th March 2018, 7:22 pm
Congrats on the new pi. I read a lot here about requests for ‘more
memory’. As I see it the problem is not the pi3b+ design. It works
as conceived: a beautiful learners board that (accidentally?) also
happens to be a very decent production machine for maybe 85%
of all necessary tasks. The real problem is called ‘bloatware’.
Nowadays when code works, it is considered ‘finished’ when it
does what the specs say. Is optimizing on size and speed still
taught? Or do we leave that to ‘optimizing compilers’ instead of
educated programmers?
But then, I had 128 machinewords available to write a multi-device
bootloader in 1980.
Petr Hajek
15th March 2018, 7:27 pm
To everyone who thinks 1 GB is enough today and you should be
better programmer – start Java IDE – half of ram just gone!
Simon Long
15th March 2018, 8:21 pm
In that case, the people who wrote the Java IDE should be
better programmers! ;)
Petr Hajek
15th March 2018, 8:33 pm
Bad news is Java is still and will stay for many years most
popular language… ;) https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/
crumble
16th March 2018, 11:03 am
So all modern IDE developers are bad programmers? The
old times were not always the good ones. I like the features
of modern IDEs, even if they need a lot of resources.
If 1GB is enough for you, ask Eben for a higher salary. When
you live in in a bigger home, your vacuum cleaner will be on
our side, asking for more RAM to map it ;)
James Hughes
16th March 2018, 11:30 am
No, of course not. But some are. Otherwise how can you
explain that an IDE takes up an entire 1GB of RAM? IDE
facilities are great nowadays – I use Eclipse and it’s great
– but the resource requirements are absurd.
1GB should be enough for the vast majority of tasks. I
grew up with 32k, and you learn to write memory efficient
code with that level of constraint. A skill that is sadly
missing in many engineers nowadays, simply because
they have never had to worry about memory requirements.
It interesting to note that a number of the engineers
working at Raspberry Pi grew up in an era of very limited
memory, which is presumably why we are happy with 1GB
– we know how to deal with those constraints.
Petr Hajek
16th March 2018, 4:16 pm
For Pi community this will be I presume much more
catchy (“1 GB should be enough!”) than “640 kBs
shoudld be” etc. ;)
Nicholas Mutsaerts
15th March 2018, 8:50 pm
When will the POE Hat be released?! Will there be changes to the
cases to accommodate the new Raspberry Pi 3 B+ and the POE
Hat?! I would like to purchase all items at the same time.
Jack Burton
15th March 2018, 11:03 pm
one would assume that anyone designing new cases will make
it to fit the new Pi3 b+
some of my cases will not work with out some Dremel work
Mike Powell
15th March 2018, 9:35 pm
Congratulations Eben, Gordon, Roger, James, Mike and all the
other talented crew at Raspberry Pi. It’s been a privilege to be
associated with you all this time.
Regards,
Mike Powell.
Eben Upton — post author
17th March 2018, 5:33 pm
Likewise. It’s been a hell of a six years, right?
Anatolii
15th March 2018, 9:46 pm
I was expecting 2 GB of RAM
Lee Wilkin
15th March 2018, 9:54 pm
Thank you for all your hard work on Raspberry Pi 3B+!
I’m astonished how you continue to evolve (and I really do mean
evolve – user feedback (from commercial, industrial and consumer
deployment) is your “environment” while efficiency and adaptation
power your iterative processes).
How do you manage to improve the tech while remaining at ? It’s
an almost mystical achievement! (You’re a computing wonder of
the world.)
I have Windows PCs and a couple of Macs. I love them all; but
there will always be a special place in my heart for Raspberry Pi.
:-)
Congratulations on your latest product. I can’t wait to get my
hands on the 3B+!
P.S. Love the elevator music on your new video. :-)
Eben Upton — post author
17th March 2018, 5:36 pm
Glad you like the elevator music. Brian (our videographer) is a
stone-cold genius. I nearly fell off my chair laughing when I
heard it the first time.
Paul R
15th March 2018, 9:59 pm
My Raspberry Pi 3 B+ just shipped! Can’t wait to try it out!
Suggestion for future versions: a color-coded GPIO header like on
the Tinker Board. It will make setting up projects much easier.
rpiMike
15th March 2018, 10:00 pm
My Pi 3B+ turned up today. Definitely a nice speed boost and runs
noticeably cooler even without heatsink/fan. Running Minecraft at
just over 60 degrees.
https://youtu.be/Tr6Mcet99xA
Great work team :)
DerHerbert
15th March 2018, 11:38 pm
Will we get a Pi2-Model_B-v1.3 with an BCM2837B
I don’t need wlan and BT.
Eben Upton — post author
17th March 2018, 5:34 pm
We’re considering what, if any, derivatives of the 3B+ design to
put on the roadmap. Watch this space.
rclark
16th March 2018, 1:22 am
Cool. For a device, it is great (how you can fit all the neat features
in for the price is just amazing). This new one looks even better.
Still swimming in RAM (1G is way overkill). 1+Ghz quad processor
Swimming in disk space, as I usually get 16G SD cards. SSH in to
test/run apps (C/C++ or Python 3 here). I run RPIs usually
headless (glad Raspbian Lite was introduced) . sftp to get/put my
programs. Wireless and hardwire Ethernet, USB… Hats galore,
interface to Arduinos, etc. when needed. All the amazing Linux
tools at your finger tips… Far cry from when I started with Z-80s,
6502s, 680xx, 8086 back when for automation. Yet my company
was able to run hydro power plants, substations and such on
those ‘old’ cpus. In fact we still use 25Mhz 68332 custom boards
for SCADA in some of our substations.
So, I just don’t get some of the complaints… There is so much
potential here… for . Pocket change really. When I need extra
umph for something (say cross-compile a custom kernel), or need
to use a really fast graphical interface, I have desktop computers
for that.
anon34879
16th March 2018, 3:16 am
Does this RP3+ still have the friction fit SD card slot that the RP3
had, or have you gone back to the push to eject type slot that all
the previous Pi’s had?
That friction fit one on the RP3 is a PITA to get the card out of
when the Pi is installed in many cases. I usually end up having to
use tweezers to remove the SD card from the laser cut c4labs.net
cases I like to use with all my Pi’s
Gordon Hollingworth
16th March 2018, 2:08 pm
If you buy the official Raspberry Pi case you’ll see that we
thought of that!
The main problem with the Pi2 push push connector is that it
was much more expensive and the lock tended to break which
meant you could never get it working again without removing
the tiny spring!!!
anon89673
17th March 2018, 1:19 am
True, but the thing I like about the c4labs and other similar
cases is they have a flat top on them. I can easily stack up all
my Pi’s either in use or in storage on a shelf. All 4 of my Pis
1A+, 1B+, 2B+ and 3B are all in these cases which nicely
stack.
AndrewS
16th March 2018, 3:25 pm
When the friction-fit micro SD card slot was first revealed, I
remember reading that lots of people accidentally ejected the
card from the previous push-push slot when they didn’t mean to
by picking up the Pi.
John Nicholls
16th March 2018, 6:41 am
Congratulation to Eben and the entire RPi team, this is a great
upgrade to the RPi3, I have the new RPi3 Model B+ sitting on my
desk already.
Same form factor, 3 x Ethernet Speed, 3 x WiFi speed, 1.4GHz
processor clock, Network bootable no SD card required when
Network booting, Power over Ethernet interface, US price, it does
not get any better than this!!!
I think if you open source the PoE Hat design that this would leave
a lot of options for all sorts of IoT capability to be designed into
custom PoE Hats
As a company that designed our own custom hardware for many
years, I have to say, Fantastic work RPi team!
Eben Upton — post author
17th March 2018, 5:38 pm
Thank you. As you may gather from the video, this one has
been harder to get to the finish line than any previous product.
5GHz wireless in particular is just *hard*.
Timo A.
16th March 2018, 7:00 am
No more “xenon death flash”?
James Hughes
16th March 2018, 10:41 am
ZDF was fixed years ago….
Timo A.
20th March 2018, 3:45 pm
I didn’t know that. I can remember a discussion i had with
someone who basically said the RasPi is rubbish. And one
major flaw he mentioned was the XDF (or ZDF? typo??). And
that was last summer.
What version of the RasPi was the first that wasn’t affected
by any kind of stronger flashlight?
Liz Upton
20th March 2018, 5:29 pm
Only the very first batch of Raspberry Pi 2s were affected
back in 2015 – Pis which actually demonstrate this
behaviour are, funnily enough, a bit of a collectors’ item
now. We replaced the affected package with one with an
opaque covering immediately…and honestly, if you’ve
been convinced by your buddy that a sensitivity to
paparazzi is a “major flaw”, I don’t think we’re ever going to
be able to bring you around! See
https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/xenon-death-flash-a-free-
physics-lesson/ for more. Your friend definitely didn’t have
one last summer unless he’d been one of the first people
to buy a Raspberry Pi 2 and is still using that. And is
regularly firing flash bulbs at it from a distance of less than
ten centimetres.
(My ten cents: for some reason the Wikipedia page about
Raspberry Pi, which we don’t edit because of NPOV, but
which we occasionally look at and sigh at a bit, used to
make a HUGE MASSIVE GREAT BIG DEAL out of the
Xenon Death Flash; at one point it was about a quarter of
the article. It’s really, really not a big deal and never was –
it’d only affect you if you were taking close-up flash
photographs of your Pi – but that weighting on Wikipedia
made some people attach enormous significance to it, for
some reason.)
Timo A.
21st March 2018, 4:43 pm
He didn’t convince me at all and he is in no way a buddy
of mine. It was a forum discussion where he numbered
the “many design flaws” of the RasPi and why it is
anything but robust.
Mostly he embarrassed himself because most “flaws”
where in fact user mistakes that could lead to “frying”
the RasPi.
At one point he claimed that not only flash lights but also
sunlight or lasers could cause the RasPi to reboot. And
he said that there where several components on the
RasPi that could cause these light induced reboots
(OpenDIE HDMI? Didn’t really understand what he was
talking about. Maybe he just wanted to impress me).
I own several RasPis and never was affected by any of
the problems he mentioned. Mostly because i mostly
double-check what i’m doing before booting up my Pi. I
even short-circuited a Zeros GPIOs once. It just didn’t
boot up, wasn’t fried and still works without an issue.
James Hughes
21st March 2018, 8:27 pm
Sounds like someone making stuff up to sound
impressive. Or not, in this case. Good anecdote!
Paul R
21st March 2018, 7:23 pm
I’m one of the “lucky” ones to have a Raspberry Pi 2 that
suffers from the Xenon Death Flash. I discovered it when I
was taking pictures of my project to upload.
DerHerbert
16th March 2018, 8:53 am
“Improved PXE network and USB mass-storage booting”
Will this make it’s way to the Pi2_v1.2 and the Pi3 too?
James Hughes
16th March 2018, 10:51 am
Not in current plans.
DerHerbert
16th March 2018, 1:22 pm
:(
Why don’t they benefit from this enhancements? Physical
limitations (as always)?
Gordon Hollingworth
16th March 2018, 2:05 pm
Because the updates done to fix this were done in the
ROM on the silicon. Basically I’ve been finding bugs in the
2837A0 bootrom and fixing some of them in the B0
bootrom. The 2836 and 2835 silicon have not been
through this revision and it would cost us an extra tapeout
to fix…
DerHerbert
16th March 2018, 5:02 pm
TNX for clarification.
So, when do we get a Pi2 with the new 2837B
Ononimo
16th March 2018, 10:33 am
I bought a 3B in January
:|
James Hughes
16th March 2018, 10:52 am
500k people have bought Pi3 since January!
brendan
16th March 2018, 12:18 pm
Will there be a future update that allows connection to enterprise
wifi? just wondering as I would like to use my pi in university but
the wifi requires account and password and its greyed out when I
try to select it?
James Hughes
16th March 2018, 3:00 pm
The Pi should be able to connect to most sorts of wireless
network already. If yours won’t I suggest asking about it on the
forum.
Brian
16th March 2018, 1:20 pm
With all this effort to improve on the Pi 3, why did they not
increase the memory to 2GB? How difficult would that have been?
Simon Long
16th March 2018, 1:27 pm
As has been pointed out repeatedly in these comments, the
SoC used on the Pi 3 can access a maximum of 1GB of
memory. In order to access more memory, a completely new
SoC would have been needed. So the answer to your question
“how difficult would that have been” is “very”.
Petr Hajek
16th March 2018, 4:23 pm
There is one funny thing though – DDR3 and DDR4 is much
cheaper than DDR2. So will it not pay off in some millions of
sales instead still ordering DDR2 for all today models?
I DO look forward to Pi3B+++++++ with SO-DIMM slots! ;)
Simon Long
16th March 2018, 6:33 pm
It’s not a question of money; it’s a question of the
development time required to source a new SoC and to
redesign the Pi (and its software) to accept it. Neither of
these are trivial…
Brian
16th March 2018, 1:28 pm
If the POE Hat works with true 48v POE, then this would be a big
deal as you could just plug in the pi to any available port with
POE. Many organizations use Cisco POE switches just for this
purpose.
juliuswerning@gmail.com
16th March 2018, 5:09 pm
Great news!
juliuswerning@gmail.com
Nick Pettefar
16th March 2018, 5:44 pm
I really really hope that you will soon incorporate a LI battery
socket or other connection and the required hardware and
software to run from the LI battery and re-charge it when 5V is re-
connected and free the Pi from the wall. That’s the One Thing I
prefer the (late and lamented) C.H.I.P. for, the ability to run off the
grid. One little socket…. come on!
I am waiting for my two new Pi 3+’s to arrive, Currently my 3’s lock
up when using the Chromium browser with more than a couple of
tabs and I am fed up of having to reset them.
Graham Toal
16th March 2018, 6:18 pm
I appreciate that you do incremental improvements to upgrade
performance at the same price, but I can’t help but think the effort
would have been better spent in ramping up production of the Pi
Zero (& W) and even in upgrading the Zero to 4 core if that’s
possible. Most of the projects I do with Pi’s could be done with
Zeroes but getting them in units of more than 1 is impossible, and
single units still have the huge shipping overhead that makes them
not cost effective.
Simon Long
16th March 2018, 6:37 pm
One of the reasons the Zero is cheap is because it has an
(older) single-core processor. The cost of parts is what chiefly
dictates the cost of the Zero, and to keep the cost down, we
can’t (at present) afford to put a quad-core processor on it.
Development effort doesn’t increase the number of Zeros we
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Development effort doesn’t increase the number of Zeros we
can make – that’s down to limitations on how many of them the
factory can produce – and it doesn’t enable us to put a quad-
core on the Zero.
So, rather than sitting around twiddling our thumbs, we thought
that we’d spend the time and effort on the 3B+…
MW
16th March 2018, 8:05 pm
I can not wait any longer and say a great big thanks to the RPT /
RPF and the Community of Testers for this “update”
Now to all the people who are wanting more RAM, USB C,
GigaEthernet, on-board POE etcetera, you are living in
“”cloud cuckoo land””
Go buy a Pine, Orange, Banana or whatever and enjoy zero
testing, zero quality control and zero support.
The Odroid is the only SBC which is anywhere near an alternative
and I am sure you will find what you need there..
Alan Givati
16th March 2018, 10:00 pm
Hello and a big congratulations to the Raspberry Pi team. Its really
good to see such a solid incremental update whilst keeping the
cost at . This is a long list of improvements that shows you really
are paying attention to important details. The quality of the
platform, its stabilty and community really makes this a great
choice for so many projects. Thanks for your work and dedication
over the years.
Andreas Müller
17th March 2018, 12:12 am
Hi
am using P3 as musical instrument with USB keyboard. I build my
images with Openembedded/Yocto and it is sooooo much fun. A
project that’ll never be ‘finished’ with all aspects I love:
Music/hardware/software…
When making ‘realtime’ music changing CPU frequency is
something to avoid: It causes lots of so called X-Runs.
Now my question: How would P3+ behave when running kernel
with governor ‘performance’ (@Pi3 1.2Ghz all the time)?
Eben Upton — post author
17th March 2018, 5:43 pm
Quite well, I’d imagine. A 3B+ would run at a significantly lower
voltage (40-50mV) than a 3B at 1.2GHz.
mihai iuliu
17th March 2018, 12:49 pm
win 10 work with Rpi3B+ ?
Jack Burton
19th March 2018, 2:27 pm
full win 10 will notwork on the Pi ,there is a win10 IOT core
https://www.windowscentral.com/how-install-windows-10-iot-
raspberry-pi-3
Tobias K
18th March 2018, 12:12 am
Are the mounting holes and board dimensions of the 3B+ the
same as for the 3B (in other words, can the cases for the 3B also
be used for the 3B+)?
Jack Burton
19th March 2018, 2:30 pm
Most cases will still fit ,there are 4 new pins for the power over
internet ,that will be the way for some cases ,especially Pillow
type cases ,nothing a little Drumel wont fix
Laurenti Tolledo
19th March 2018, 6:59 am
Hi there!
Can wait to get my hands on the new RPi3B+, as of this writing
still not available here in Japan though.
One question, can I just swap my RPi3 Stretch mSD image to the
RPi3B+ or do I still need to re-install via NOOBS?
Simon Long
19th March 2018, 7:41 am
You’ll need to update the firmware on your RPi 3 image before it
will boot on a 3+ – sudo apt-get update / sudo apt-get upgrade
should do it.
Heimo Wissing
20th March 2018, 10:41 am
Nice work!
But what does “Improved PXE network and USB mass-storage
booting” mean? Is still setup necessary with writing a write once
bit? Is there a longer drive ready delay? Is that IMPROVEMENT
documented anywhere?
Heimo Wissing
20th March 2018, 10:41 am
Nice work!
But what does “Improved PXE network and USB mass-storage
booting” mean? Is still setup necessary with writing a write once
bit? Is there a longer drive ready delay? Is that IMPROVEMENT
documented anywhere?
Tom
20th March 2018, 3:47 pm
I have just got my new pi+ it boots OK from an USB stick (No SD
card). The pi seems to be running OK but the act has a constant
pattern of off followed by a burst of flashes then off again – not
sure if this is a concern. I also notice that only the yellow ethernet
led lights up.
However, I cannot get it to boot from the network. A few seconds
after power up there is the briefest glow from the act led. The
Ethernet leds do not light up at all and after about 20 secs the act
flashes bursts of four offs. I am able to boot from my network OK
with a rpi3.
Grateful for any suggestions.
Mike
21st March 2018, 9:05 am
If you’re using NOOBS and it was made prior to March 14, 2018,
the brand-new Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+ may not boot from the
SD card – even if you fully updated your system with sudo apt-get
upgrade or sudo apt-get dist-upgrade.
For details on this issue, and how I resolved it, please visit my
forum posting:
https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=63&t=208596
Mort
21st March 2018, 12:28 pm
It has already almost everything I was dreaming about. One last
part is missing. The USB 3.0! :)
I would be more than happy to use the Raspberry as a NAS at the
reasonable speeds.
Great work, team!
DonM
22nd March 2018, 5:03 pm
I apologize if this gets posted twice – I can’t see my last message
on the thread, but maybe it hasn’t been approved yet?
I was just wondering if there was an approximate ETA for the PoE
Hat? Days, Weeks, Months… and is the blog the best way to find
out about its release?
Thanks – really looking forward to getting the 3B+ in my hands
and testing my project with PoE.
DonM
22nd March 2018, 8:36 pm
AHHH – I just found Eden’s response from March 14th
“We have all the components to build our first 20k in hand, so
we’re literally just waiting for a manufacturing slot. Late April if
we’re lucky, early to mid May more likely.”
Percy Kawas
22nd March 2018, 6:35 pm
Anyone has measured power consumed by Pi-3+ ?? My quick
measurements show an increase of about 25-30%. Can anyone
validate or refute this?
Helen Lynn
22nd March 2018, 7:23 pm
I bet Alex Eames has written about this… ah yes, he has indeed
:-)
Simon Long
23rd March 2018, 2:49 pm
From what I have heard, we see about a 5% increase in power
consumption on a Pi 3B+ compared to a Pi 3B – that is with wifi
and Bluetooth turned off on both and no Ethernet connection.
The new networking hardware on 3B+ is likely to use more
power than the equivalents on the 3B, which is the (largely
unavoidable) price paid for the improved performance.
Silvio
25th March 2018, 2:02 pm
Cypress CYW43455 does not use the USB bus, right?
James Hughes
26th March 2018, 11:06 am
Its on the SDIO bus.
Blackcorvo
27th March 2018, 1:30 pm
I think these are good updates to the board,but one that’s been
missing since the Raspberry Pi 2 is data over the micro USB port.
It would be much more manageable for small builds to only have
one cable for power and USB data! For example a PiTop using a
Lapdock.
It’s a small thing, but could make a world of difference for some
people.
Chris
27th March 2018, 5:06 pm
Ordered a 3B+ and NOOBS from Farnell on the 20th, it won’t
arrive until nearly the end of April! What happened to all these
thousands of 3B+’s that are supposed to be available?
Dan Jones
4th April 2018, 1:28 am
I’m currently working on a stacking HAT and I’m interested in using
it in-conjunction with the new PoE HAT. How much power can the
new PoE HAT deliver to the Pi? Are we talking type 2/3/4 PoE?
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miguel lopez
19th April 2018, 8:59 am
Are you going to update compute module too?
If the answer is yes, please include also wifi in the module.
It would be great.
riddick
6th June 2018, 7:31 pm
Waiting to see RPi 3B+ on Amazon. I can see lots of regular RPi 3
for , but cheapest RPi 3B+ is . Aren’t 90% of RPi bought through
Amazon?
JacoR
5th August 2018, 6:22 am
Any update on the ICASA approval? We are still waiting to buy the
RPI 3B+ here in South Africa.
AWS guy
7th August 2018, 2:59 pm
Amazing! Can’t wait to get one. Is amazon a good seller or should
we just buy from linked retailers?
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